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Natural Science Forum / Physics / Acoustics / May 2007



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Resonator panel from RESPA

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hadisumoro - 06 May 2007 18:46 GMT
Hello,

I just found out : http://www.respa.de/en/start.htm. This is pretty
interesting. The panel is tuned somehow (reminds me to RPG's modex/
broadband panel) and I guess comb filtering will happen as well and
color the sound. Any thoughts on this product? I wonder if anyone here
used/happen to know this product.

Hadi
Angelo Campanella - 07 May 2007 15:46 GMT
> I just found out : http://www.respa.de/en/start.htm. This is pretty
> interesting. The panel is tuned somehow (reminds me to RPG's modex/
> broadband panel) and I guess comb filtering will happen as well and
> color the sound.

    RPG devices are aimed at producing a great deal of diffusion at all
frequencies, but that may not be what is needed in a particular room.
Especially when diffusion is needed at frequencies below a few hundred
Hz since RPG diffusers are not very big.

    I suggest you investigate what your hall lacks in terms of diffusion,
if any is needed, then find diffuserobjects and methods that suit that
frequency range. As acoustics spans many octaves, the objects required
to produce diffusion at such frequencies will vary widely in size and
even appearance. Columns, niches, windows, furnture and odd walls serve
to diffuse low frequency sound, for instance.

    Note that the Freiburg hall repair includes "mobile elements", large
enough to diffuse lower frequencies .

> Any thoughts on this product? I wonder if anyone here
> used/happen to know this product.

    Modern "diffuser" manufacturers easily see the futility of attmpting to
package and sell diffursers for the lowest frequencies. In that case, it
is the responsibility of the consultant to ptovide the geometric design
of the elements required for diffusion. Then the carpenters and general
contractors serve to build them.
Ethan Winer - 07 May 2007 19:22 GMT
Hadi,

Angelo mentioned that you have a hall to treat, but I saw nothing about that
in your post. Regardless, I find the idea of adding resonance to a listening
room, as suggested on that site, to be the wrong approach. The usual
treatment goal for smaller rooms as shown in the photos on that site is to
remove resonances, not add them.

Can you can explain more about what you're trying to accomplish? And what
size room and the purpose too please.

--Ethan

> I just found out : http://www.respa.de/en/start.htm. This is pretty
> interesting. The panel is tuned somehow (reminds me to RPG's modex/
> broadband panel) and I guess comb filtering will happen as well and
> color the sound. Any thoughts on this product? I wonder if anyone here
> used/happen to know this product.
Savant - 08 May 2007 20:24 GMT
These products appear to me to be intended for use within close
proximity to a sound source.  Their use above or behind an orchestra,
musical group, soloist, or talker would appear to be the intention.
Which, IMO, is what they should be restricted to.  Their pictures of
the use of these panels in office environments is a little suspect as
that would be a (IMO) bad application.

Incorporating such panels into a concert hall, recital hall, or even a
large studio recording room would not be a bad thing.  Though I would
doubt that they would serve as a stand-alone solution to any room
acoustics problem.  I.e., other treatments such as acoustical
absorbers and diffusers should also be considered for these
applications.  Of course, it would seem to me that the same effects -
at possibly reduced cost - would be achievable with off-the-shelf
decorative wood panels incorporated into, e.g., an orchestra shell
design that's facilitated by an experienced acoustician.

Diffusors could also provide enhanced performance in the same sorts of
applications.

I don't think a direct comparison can be drawn to RPG's Modex brand
since the latter are specifically designed as "bass traps."

My $0.02.

Savant
hadisumoro - 11 May 2007 16:22 GMT
> These products appear to me to be intended for use within close
> proximity to a sound source.  Their use above or behind an orchestra,
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> Savant

Thank you Savant,

I think you are right, it can't be compared to the RPG's modex after
all. Before going back to your topic,

> Angelo mentioned that you have a hall to treat, but I saw nothing about that
> in your post. Regardless, I find the idea of adding resonance to a listening
> room, as suggested on that site, to be the wrong approach. The usual
> treatment goal for smaller rooms as shown in the photos on that site is to
> remove resonances, not add them.

You are right Ethan, there is no hall to be treated and I agree with
you to remove resonances. At the end, I was jsut curious about this
product and wondering if someone uses this and listen to it. As
mentiond by Savant above, it is a useful acoustic shell, which I agree
(if the coloration due to the resonance can be tuned/controlled).

It is said in the website that this is a wall resonator. I'm curious
if this really change the spectral of the instrument nearby
(regardless of the comb filtering). I am sorry if my question was not
clear. The panel looks hard, so a reflection can occur and comb
filtering will happen depending on the distance between the source and
the wall resonator, and again If the spectral can really be tuned,
this is the interesting part and I m wondering if someone use this/
listen to this before. Thanks for the responses.

Hadi
Ethan Winer - 12 May 2007 15:55 GMT
Hadi,

> It is said in the website that this is a wall resonator.

My take on this is it's a bogus product aimed at audiophiles with more money
than common sense. There are a lot of products like that aimed at gullible
audiophooles, based entirely on the placebo effect. Such as the Cathedral
Panels and Fast Audio Resonators described in my Acoustics Fraud Report:

http://www.ethanwiner.com/fraud.html

It may be legitimate as a reflector to "amplify" a soloist, like the rear
wall of an outdoors band shell. But the explanations are pure BS:

 Harmonization of the oscillation and thereby
- ideal beginning and ending of the cycles
- great oscillation stability
- high degree of resonance effectiveness
- ideal dissolution of sound
- high transparency of tone and speech

I HATE it when my cycles don't begin and end ideally! Sheesh.

The lack of pricing is also suspect. "Ask us for a quote!" I don't have time
to play 20 questions. Just tell me how much it costs, okay? :->)

--Ethan
 
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