Special attributes of everything that was, or is, recognised to be holy (JP)
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janpajak@gmail.com - 16 Apr 2008 07:33 GMT A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. For example, let us consider attributes of such "holy" substances and objects, as: (1) "daily bread" (by the Christian religion considered to be a representation of the body of Christ), (2) "coconuts", (3) "drinking water" (by first Christians used for christening, while by pagans utilised in water dowsing), (4) "red wine" (considered to represent the blood of Jesus). If one compares their attributes with attributes of other very similar substances or objects, e.g. with attributes of: (1n) white bread or buns, (2n) fruits of tropical durian, (3n) undrinkable water, (4n) white wine, then outcomes of this comparison become very meaningful. Namely, it then turns out that everything that in past was described as "holy" actually displays attributes which are beneficial to people at many levels, and which do NOT introduce any side effects. In turn everything that was NOT considered holy shows also various attributes that are undesirable for humans - in spite that in almost every aspect it is similar to a related holy substance or object. For example, in spite that the "daily bread" and the "white bread" are baked in a similar manner and from almost the same flour, differences between their consequences for health of people are huge. Similarly, in spite that "red wine" and "white wine" are produced through the same process from almost the same grapes which grew on exactly the same soil, their influences onto drinking people are very different. In fact these differences in attributes of whatever in past (and sometimes also today) was called "holy", from attributes of whatever is NOT considered to be holy, cannot be justify exclusively with the use of findings and knowledge of present "atheistic" science. So let us now provide here several most meaningful examples of extraordinary attributes of something that in past was considered to be "holy". In order to shorten the discussion, below is analysed only a single attribute which does NOT appear in similar substances and objects that are NOT considered to be holy. But independently from the attribute discussed below, each substance and object mentioned below displays also a whole range of further extraordinary attributes which are very difficult to justify by present atheistic science. So here are these examples:
(1) Irreplaceable attributes of the holy "daily bread". As we know the humanity invented a large variety of dishes which are made of flour. To such dishes belong: buns, cakes, pancakes, macaroons, dumplings, etc., etc. But only the so-called "daily bread" was considered in past to be holy. This "daily bread" used to be wholegrain bread, baked from the unsifted wholemeal rye flour. The dough for this bread was fermented before baking in a similar manner like until present time are fermented the Japanese "miso" and Korean "kimchi" (for descriptions of Korean "kim-chi" - see item #B1 from the web page "korea.htm" - about the mysterious, fascinating, moral, and progressive Korea). In the result of this fermentation, the daily bread become black like the soil from which it grew, and thus considered to be "too common" for wealthy people. Only this bread in old times was treated with the highest respect and worshiped as holy. White bread, buns, cakes, and other products made of flour, were NOT considered to be "holy". In fact I still remember until today from Poland of the times of my childhood, means Poland of 1950s, such manifestations of the respect to "daily bread" which were still practiced then. For example, at that time people used to say sorry to, and to kiss, a slice of bread when they accidentally allowed it to fall to the floor. Old-timers never threw away to rubbish even smallest crumbs of bread. Furthermore, to express their respect to this bread, men used to take hats off their heads for the duration of eating - even in most cold days. As present people discovered this, the formerly "holy" daily bread in fact displays attributes that deserve the holiness. For example, eating this bread in any quantities does NOT bring any undesirable consequences to the human health. (On the other hand eating large amounts of any other products made from flour turns out to be unhealthy.) Furthermore, people can survive by eating exclusively this holy "daily bread", while they cannot survive by eating exclusively any other dish made of flour.
(2) The fact that coconuts never fall on heads of people, in spite that in light of statistics there should be cases of falling coconuts hitting some people in heads. As I explained this on a separate web page "fruit.htm" - about tropical fruits from the area of Pacific, "in many tropical countries coconut palms are considered to be 'holy trees'" which were designed especially by God to satisfy all basic needs of people. (Notice that the holiness of coconuts is recognised in there in a similar manner as in old Europe the holiness of "daily bread" was practiced.) The holiness of coconut palms proves itself because e.g. on small oceanic islands, on which is NOT growing anything else apart from this palm, in fact coconut palms are providers of everything. In some religions, e.g. Hinduism, gods receive gifts from coconuts. The Bible says that palm branches were placed in front of walking Jesus. This holiness of coconut palms is there also a source of the deep belief which prevails in countries in which coconuts grow, namely that in order to NOT harm people heavy "coconuts never fall onto heads of humans". Actually in many tropical countries, e.g. in Malaysia, locals are saying that "coconut palms have eyes" - thus they never drop a coconut on heads of humans. I personally was very intrigued by this belief. So whenever I had an opportunity to visit an area where coconut palms grow, I always asked locals whether they know a case that a coconut fell on someone's head. I must confirm here, that in spite of my wide and many years long asking "I never encountered a case that someone knew someone else on the head of whom a coconut fell". Such a case would be quite well- known, because the large weight of coconuts combined with the significant height of coconut palms, would cause that the fell of a coconut on someone's head would kill such unfortunate person. Of course, this lack of cases when coconuts fall on human heads is something extraordinary and it should be explained by the "holiness" of the palm. After all, other (non-holy) trees drop their fruits completely at random, in this on human heads. I myself remember a case when a falling apple hit me in the head - fortunately was ripe and soft. In Malaysia grows a tasty fruit which just has a size of coconuts - it is called "durian". It is commonly known there, that at the time of durians' ripening, people should either keep far from these trees, or wear protective "hard hats". This is because heavy durian fruits fall "at random", including onto human heads. So it is nothing unusual to hear over there about cases of people getting hit by durian fruits.
Regrettably, someone clearly could NOT stand this extraordinary attribute of "holy palms" and decided to include also the holy coconuts into the "scientific atheism". Namely, that someone started to spread on the behalf of science the untrue claims that supposedly in the world every year dies from falling coconuts as much as 150 people. These claims make falling coconuts hypothetically even more dangerous than attacks of sharks. Such false claims were disseminated in so organised manner, that on their base various insurance companies started to develop their "coconut policies". Fortunately for the truth, some scientists decided to get to the bottom of the "research" on which the coconut deaths claims were based. Outcomes of their research were summarised later, amongst others, in the article "Lies, damn lies, and 150 coconut deaths" from page B9 of the New Zealand newspaper named "Weekend Herald", issue dated on Saturday, April 12, 2008. Searches of these scientists revealed, that the claims were made up in Australia in 2002. Only then were disseminated all over the world by an article in Daily Telegraph. At the beginning these claims referred to the publication of a Canadian professor, in which there was NO quantitative data on this subject, while the professor himself denied that he ever accumulated such quantitative data. Thus, in spite of the lies spread on this subject under a smoke screen of the official science, in fact coconuts never fall down on heads of people.
(3) The holy river Ganges in India belongs to the most biologically polluted rivers of the world. But Hindu devotes drink water directly from the river. In spite of this, Hindu who believe in holiness of this river never report an illness acquired by drinking biologically polluted water of this river.
(3) All 12 Apostles drank wine from the same cup. But the Bible does NOT report that any Apostle acquired an illness passed around due to this drinking of all of them from the same cup.
The described above documentation for the existence of extraordinary attributes (which cannot be justified nor explained on the basis of atheistic science) in all substances and objects acknowledged as "holy", was adopted from item #F2 from the web page named "bible.htm", update of 14 April 2008, or later. In turn descriptions and legends concerning coconuts and fruits of durian discussed above are presented in items #1 and #4 from the totaliztic web page "fruit.htm" about tropical fruits from the area of Pacific, update of 15 April 2008, or later. The web page "fruit.htm" should be available from following addresses ?if it was not sabotaged there by evil powers that recently rampage in the internet and all over the Earth (probably these evil powers are also responsible for organising the lies about 150 deaths per year from coconuts):
http://bible.webng.com/fruit.htm http://energy.atspace.org/fruit.htm http://evidence.ueuo.com/fruit.htm http://evil.thefreehost.biz/fruit.htm http://fruit.sitesled.com/fruit.htm http://fruit.xphost.org/fruit.htm http://god.ez-sites.ws/fruit.htm http://karma.freewebpages.org/fruit.htm http://memorial.awardspace.info/fruit.htm http://newzealand.myfreewebs.net/fruit.htm http://nirvana.scienceontheweb.net/fruit.htm http://pigs.freehyperspace.com/fruit.htm http://parasitism.about.tc/fruit.htm http://parasitism.xphost.org/fruit.htm http://rubik.hits.io/fruit.htm http://tornado.99k.org/fruit.htm http://wszewilki.greatnow.com/fruit.htm
It is also worth to know that under each address indicated above ALL the web pages of totalizm should be available (unless some of these web pages were sabotaged in the meantime). Thus, if someone wishes to view descriptions from any other web page of totalizm, e.g. from a web page listed in this message, or listed in other totaliztic messages, then in the above addresses the name "fruit.htm" is just enough to exchange for a name of the web page that he or she wishes to view, e.g. for the name of web page "boiler.htm", "free_energy.htm", "wszewilki_jutra_uk.htm", "newzealand.htm", "free_energy.htm", "fe_cell.htm", "malbork_uk.htm", "evolution.htm", "god.htm", "bible.htm", "text_1_5.htm", "dipolar_gravity.htm", "nirvana.htm", "evil.htm", "memorial.htm", etc., etc.
Topics related to matters discussed here are also presented on blogs of totalizm which can be visited at addresses: http://www.getablog.net/totalizm http://totalizm.wordpress.com http://totalizm.myblog.net http://www.newfreehost.com/weblog/?u=god
Wi the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Motto: "Everything that is recognised to be 'holy' displays various attributes which just cannot be explained on basis of atheistic science."
P.S. The subject of the scientific "evidence for the existence of God" described here, as well as other subjects related to it, is already being discussed on various Google discussion groups. For example:
(1) The discussion of the absolute lack of scientific evidence for the non-existence of God is carried out at the internet addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/20892864b7f7690e /bbdc5b3dc1aed298#bbdc5b3dc1aed298
(2) The discussion of the biological evidence for the existence of God, is carried out at addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origins/browse_thread/thread/8040cef26d37261 f#de22942cb8fe3aee
(3) The discussion of the physical evidence for the existence of God is carried out at the internet addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/0b85905d2dc9f083 #c374dc041f3c5fdf
Sanity's Little Helper - 16 Apr 2008 12:00 GMT to alt.atheism on 16 Apr 2008:
If you belive that
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is You'll be convinced by this: http://www.lancs.ac.uk/ug/buxton/
 Signature David Silverman aa #2208 Defender of Civilisation Lord Mayor of Dis Lawful copyright holder of the term "Earthquack".
Not authentic without this signature.
Don Martin - 16 Apr 2008 13:00 GMT On Apr 16, 2:33 am, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects > which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar > substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. What a dreary, tortured load of mental masturbation.
Robert Weldon - 16 Apr 2008 17:00 GMT -usual janpak crap snipped
Why do you insist on torturing poor defenseless electrons like that?
Tokay Pino Gris - 16 Apr 2008 17:23 GMT Basically Bullshit, but I will take it apart...
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > durian, (3n) undrinkable water, (4n) white wine, then outcomes of this > comparison become very meaningful. So far to the setting. Nothing worng with it, still is Bullshit, though.
Namely, it then turns out that
> everything that in past was described as "holy" actually displays > attributes which are beneficial to people at many levels, and which do > NOT introduce any side effects. Ah, a testable prediction! Great!
In turn everything that was NOT
> considered holy shows also various attributes that are undesirable for > humans - in spite that in almost every aspect it is similar to a > related holy substance or object. Another testable prediction! This is getting somewhere.
For example, in spite that the
> "daily bread" and the "white bread" are baked in a similar manner and > from almost the same flour, differences between their consequences for > health of people are huge. Ups. But "no side effects" in "daily bread? You heard of Acrylamid? In there. Same as white bread.
Similarly, in spite that "red wine" and
> "white wine" are produced through the same process from almost the > same grapes which grew on exactly the same soil, their influences onto > drinking people are very different. Studies show that the heart-protection factor of white and red wine is the same. And "alkohol" is the same as well... "no side effects"? Be serious.
In fact these differences in
> attributes of whatever in past (and sometimes also today) was called > "holy", from attributes of whatever is NOT considered to be holy, > cannot be justify exclusively with the use of findings and knowledge > of present "atheistic" science. Would be. It just isn't true, that's all.
So let us now provide here several
> most meaningful examples of extraordinary attributes of something that > in past was considered to be "holy". In order to shorten the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > (1) [daily bread] Still is bread, still has flour in it, you heat it, you get acrylamid.
> (2) The fact that coconuts never fall on heads of people Wrong
> Still, there have been instances of coconuts falling from palms and injuring people, and claims of some fatalities. This was the subject of a paper published in 1984 that won the Ig Nobel Prize in 2001. Falling coconut deaths are often used as a comparison to shark attacks; the claim is often made that a person is more likely to be killed by a falling coconut than by a shark. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coconut
Coconuts do fall on people. Granted, no fatalities have been logged, but they DO fall on people.
[snip the rest. Just Bullshit]
Tokay
 Signature What passes for optimism is most often the effect of intellectual error.
Raymond Aron
janpajak@gmail.com - 17 Apr 2008 03:55 GMT ...
> Coconuts do fall on people. Granted, no fatalities have been logged, but > they DO fall on people. ... YES, even Wikipedia repeats this lie originating from Australia about these supposed "150 coconut deaths". The truth is that "coconuts never (on their own) fall on people". The only cases of coconuts hitting someone are when another person throws them. But then it is NOT the tree that is responsible for outcomes, but a person who throws coconuts. Actually, you are unable to provide even a songle documented case of a coconut falling on a person. However, computer keyboards are patient and they can accept your imaginary claims. But these claims beling to the category of "Lies, damn lies, and 150 coconut deaths".
By the way, you should NOT believe in everything that irresponsible people do write. Someone saw the writing on a wooden fence saying "pussy", but when he triet to feel it, he got hurted by a spliter from this fence. If you believe in every rubbish that irresponsible people do write, do not be surprised that you also may get a "splinter".
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Tokay Pino Gris - 16 Apr 2008 17:36 GMT > A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects > which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar > substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. I just found another error.
How exactly is this "scientific evidence for the existence of god"?
I mean, it is not such a bad idea NOT to eat pigs if you have no way to ensure that there are no trichines in them. Also, praying five times a day in the way muslims do (have you SEEN them? That is situps! Thats sports!) Washing before prayer? Hey, if the way to get people to clean themselves is to tell them they have to wash before prayer....
Hey, ever heard of the healing hands of monarchs in the dark ages? There IS a grain of truth in there! Before people were brought in front of the king to be touched, they were quite thoroughly CLEANED! Hey, and an infected wound... if you clean it? You know what? It gets better!
Hey, and drinking wine in these ancient times? Of COURSE it was better than drinking water. You know what alkohol is? A disinfectant! Water, you couldn't store, it gets rotten. But Wine? You can store almost indefinetly (granted, it becomes vinegar probably). AND you are not getting Montezumas Revenge.
So, let's say you are a teeny bit smarter than the masses. And you know that people do get ill from eating pork (trichins for example. You don't know about them, but you know that people get sick). How do you get people NOT to eat it? You say it is "unclean", "unholy" and that "god forbids it". Works just dandy.
Doesn't prove that royal hands do heal or that gods exit.
And CERTAINLY is not scientific evidence that gods exist.
Tokay
 Signature What passes for optimism is most often the effect of intellectual error.
Raymond Aron
Hatter - 16 Apr 2008 22:11 GMT On Apr 16, 2:33 am, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects > which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar > substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. The difference is pure bullshitonium.
Hatter
adman - 16 Apr 2008 22:31 GMT What a fascinating post. But of course the atheist will scoff, choke, and ridicule.
|A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence | of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects [quoted text clipped - 206 lines] | (1) The discussion of the absolute lack of scientific evidence for the | non-existence of God is carried out at the internet addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/20892864b7f7690e /bbdc5b3dc1aed298#bbdc5b3dc1aed298
| (2) The discussion of the biological evidence for the existence of | God, is carried out at addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origins/browse_thread/thread/8040cef26d37261 f#de22942cb8fe3aee
| (3) The discussion of the physical evidence for the existence of God | is carried out at the internet addresses: http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/0b85905d2dc9f083 #c374dc041f3c5fdf
panamfloyd@hotmail.com - 16 Apr 2008 22:40 GMT > <janpa...@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:6f1e3f80-0e7e-419c-864d-e4030a3a7656@s13g2000prd.googlegroups.com... > > What a fascinating post. But of course the atheist will scoff, choke, and > ridicule. Aw, wassamatta, my lil' missionary? Magic spells still not working? Maybe you should go home and practice. Come back in about thirty years.
-Panama Floyd, Atlanta. aa#2015/KoBAAWA!
Preventer of Work - 17 Apr 2008 01:36 GMT > What a fascinating post. But of course the atheist will scoff, choke, and > ridicule. We would only choke if we swallowed that load of horse pucky.
janpajak@gmail.com - 18 Apr 2008 02:21 GMT ...
> > What a fascinating post. But of course the atheist will scoff, choke, and > > ridicule. ... The above illustrates the main problem of present people, means both "atheists" and "believers in God". They spit at each other, scoff at each other, and do all possible nasty things, only do NOT discuss constructively. On the other hand, in order to establish the truth, both sides - means "atheists" as well as "believers in God" must start to discuss all the matters constructively. This is what I am trying to do, amongst others, through this thread. The reason - I am probably the only scientist in the world who researches God rationally and constructively in the same way as other scientists research e.g. the behaviour of the Earth's atmosphere and reasons why we experience the present climate change.
Almost the first thing that God in Her wisdom let me know when I started to research Her, is that She treats the same way both "atheists" and "believers in God". She only judges people by how moral they are and how morally they act in their lives, not whether they believe in Her or NOT. The reason for such a stand of God is that nothing in the real universe can be perfect and deprived of drawbacks. Thus for example "believers in God" act morally and have good moral skeletons, but they fail to advance the knowledge and technology of the humanity as a whole. After all, a typical believer has the same answer for every possible quention, namely "God make it so". Thus believers do not see any reason why they should seek knowledge, improve technology, advance medicine, etc. If this would be just up to believers in God, we would still live on trees or in caves. In turn "atheists" are the main reason of technological and scientific advancement of the humanity. But they promote the moral decadency. After all, for them counts only what happens now and what they manage to enjoy instantly. They do NOT care for their next incarnation, future of the humanity, fate of their soul, or for acting moraly in their lives. Thus God is actually in the proverbial situation "between the devil and the big blue sea". The only option God has in the present circumstances, is to promote both views simulatenlusly, means to promote "believes in God" in order to mainain the high moral standards of humanity, as well as to simulatenously promote the "atheism" in order to maintain the scientific and technical development of the humanity. This is why God gave us the so-called "free will" - so that we make up our minds whether we wish to believe or not in God. It is also why God in everything that is doing sticks to the so-called "canon of ambiguity". (This canon is explained in subsection JB7.4 from volume 7 of monograph [1/4] available free of charge under the name "text_1_4.htm" from all totaliztic internet addresses listed before.) The "canon of ambiguity" states that "everything that God does, She must do it is such ambiguous manner that people confronted with this can explain it in any way they wish".
What I am trying to say through the above explanations, is that I do NOT intend nor wish to change anyones personal believes. I am actually grateful that atheists do exist and that they lift the knowledge level of this civilisation (although I do NOT like their arogance towards morality). I only try to establish truths relating to God through a rational and unbiased discussion between atheists and believers. (It is easy to realise, because I do research God and I am absolutely sure that God does exist, that I represent the point of view of a devoted scientist-believer in God and therefore I try to learn God's goals, principles of action, intentions, etc.). And one of these truths that I am trying to establish, is that at the moment a healthy balance between believers and atheists is actually out of balance. So God must correct this situation somehow - and we see the way God started to correct it (e.g. by intending to exterminate the majority of non- believing humanity). So if we manage to find out the way of helping God to restore this balance again, then God will NOT need to exterminate all these three-quorters of the human population. For this reason it is in vital interest of all of us, means the same "believers in God" as "athists", to help restoring this balance. Of course, we can help it in an easy way, by stopping the dissemination of exclusively "athistic" knowledge, and starting to disseminate the balanced knowledge which shows both points of view. This is the reason why I am devoted to point the attention of people at these aspects of our knowledge which certify for the existence of God. In this way I try to contribute to the restoration of the balance. Also in this way I do NOT try to change anyone's view, but only provide scientific facts on the basis of which everyone have the right to make up his or her mind in any way that he or she wishes.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
P.S. About the current situation on the Earth, when the healthy balance between believers (who maintain morality of the human population, but fail to develop humanity scientifically) and atheists (who lift the knowledge of humanity but cause the moral decadence) got "out of balance", is a new web page of totalizm named "will.htm" (about roles of the "free will" and the "canon of ambiguity" in the mainatinance of simulatneous scientific and moral development of humans). I invite everyone to have a look at this new web page.
Hatter - 17 Apr 2008 13:31 GMT > <janpa...@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:6f1e3f80-0e7e-419c-864d-e4030a3a7656@s13g2000prd.googlegroups.com... > > What a fascinating post. But of course the atheist will scoff, choke, and > ridicule. Guess why? It is scoffable, choke worthy, and ridiculous. What else could we do? Laud this pile of bullshit?
Hatter
janpajak@gmail.com - 19 Apr 2008 03:06 GMT ...
> Guess why? It is scoffable, choke worthy, and ridiculous. What else > could we do? Laud this pile of bullshit? ... Of course, you could also discuss it rationally and constructively. But a constructive and rational discussion belongs to the sphere of "moral activities" - as it obeys so-called "moral laws". On the other hand, it is well known that every present atheist does NOT know how to act morally. So atheists can only swear, spit, scoff, and do whatever immoral they learned to do, at all logical and scientific arguments which do NOT fit into their close minds. No wonder that because of the overwhelming majority of scientists subscribe to such atheistic views, the present world is going down as we see it going right now.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
John Smith - 19 Apr 2008 03:15 GMT On Apr 18, 12:31 am, Hatter <Hatte...@gmail.com> wrote: ...
> Guess why? It is scoffable, choke worthy, and ridiculous. What else > could we do? Laud this pile of bullshit? ... Of course, you could also discuss it rationally and constructively.
***You cannot discuss piles of sh.t and puke rationally. ***Present sdomething ratinal, and it will be discussed rationally.
But a constructive and rational discussion belongs to the sphere of "moral activities" - as it obeys so-called "moral laws". On the other hand, it is well known that every present atheist does NOT know how to act morally.
***Well know by whom .......... idiotic morons like you?
So atheists can only swear, spit, scoff, and do whatever immoral they learned to do, at all logical and scientific arguments which do NOT fit into their close minds.
***Surely you're NOT insane enough to suggest that the original post was either logical or scientific ....are you?!?!?!?!
No wonder that because of the overwhelming majority of scientists subscribe to such atheistic views, the present world is going down as we see it going right now.
**Prove the present world is going down. **Prove that atheism is the cause of this. **Prove that science is the cause of this. **Prove that there is a VALID link between atheism and science. **Prove that science is the cause of this. **Prove that the overwhelming majority of scientists are atheists.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
**Just another pile of puke sh.t crap!
janpajak@gmail.com - 19 Apr 2008 03:26 GMT ...
> **Prove the present world is going down. > **Prove that atheism is the cause of this. > **Prove that science is the cause of this. > **Prove that there is a VALID link between atheism and science. > **Prove that science is the cause of this. > **Prove that the overwhelming majority of scientists are atheists. ... Well, you also cannot formally prove that is otherwise. On the other hand, it is enough to look around us and see what happens with the present civilisation. Immorality, pesimism, devaluation, unemployment, hunger, wars, etc., etc. All these represent items of evidence that the above does NOT even need to be proven, and still is true.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Cory Albrecht - 19 Apr 2008 04:19 GMT janpajak@gmail.com wrote, on 2008/04/18 22:26:
> ... >> **Prove the present world is going down. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > ... > Well, you also cannot formally prove that is otherwise. On the other And you can't formally prove that the universe and everything in it was not created Last Thursday, along with all our memories of what we think happened before that day.
Sorry, Jan, but declaiming "You can't prove me wrong, therefore I am right" is nor actually proving your claims.
> hand, it is enough to look around us and see what happens with the > present civilisation. Immorality, pesimism, devaluation, unemployment, > hunger, wars, etc., etc. All these represent items of evidence that > the above does NOT even need to be proven, and still is true. How much you wanna bet that all those things existed back in the very religious Middle ages in Europe? There for, by your (il)logic, all that stuff is caused by Christianity.
janpajak@gmail.com - 20 Apr 2008 01:29 GMT ...
> And you can't formally prove that the universe and everything in it was > not created Last Thursday, along with all our memories of what we think > happened before that day. > > Sorry, Jan, but declaiming "You can't prove me wrong, therefore I am > right" is nor actually proving your claims. ... I see - you believe in "guilty unless proven innocent"! Well, I can actually prove that "the universe and everything in it was not created Last Thursday" - the scientific foundations for such a proof are provided in item #B1 (on the self-evolution of God) of the totaliztic web page "evolution.htm". I recommend to have a look at this web page and at item #B1 in it. You should be able to find it at following addresses: http://bible.webng.com/evolution.htm http://energy.atspace.org/evolution.htm http://evidence.ueuo.com/evolution.htm http://evil.thefreehost.biz/evolution.htm http://fruit.sitesled.com/bevolution.htm http://fruit.xphost.org/evolution.htm http://god.ez-sites.ws/evolution.htm http://karma.freewebpages.org/evolution.htm http://memorial.awardspace.info/evolution.htm http://newzealand.myfreewebs.net/evolution.htm http://nirvana.scienceontheweb.net/evolution.htm http://pigs.freehyperspace.com/evolution.htm http://parasitism.about.tc/evolution.htm http://parasitism.xphost.org/evolution.htm http://rubik.hits.io/evolution.htm http://tornado.99k.org/evolution.htm http://wszewilki.greatnow.com/evolution.htm
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
adman - 20 Apr 2008 01:55 GMT On Apr 19, 3:19 pm, Cory Albrecht <coryalbre...@hotmail.com> wrote: ...
> And you can't formally prove that the universe and everything in it was > not created Last Thursday, along with all our memories of what we think > happened before that day. > > Sorry, Jan, but declaiming "You can't prove me wrong, therefore I am > right" is nor actually proving your claims. ... I see - you believe in "guilty unless proven innocent"! Well, I can actually prove that "the universe and everything in it was not created Last Thursday" - the scientific foundations for such a proof are provided in item #B1 (on the self-evolution of God) of the totaliztic web page "evolution.htm". I recommend to have a look at this web page and at item #B1 in it. You should be able to find it at following addresses: http://bible.webng.com/evolution.htm http://energy.atspace.org/evolution.htm http://evidence.ueuo.com/evolution.htm http://evil.thefreehost.biz/evolution.htm http://fruit.sitesled.com/bevolution.htm http://fruit.xphost.org/evolution.htm http://god.ez-sites.ws/evolution.htm http://karma.freewebpages.org/evolution.htm http://memorial.awardspace.info/evolution.htm http://newzealand.myfreewebs.net/evolution.htm http://nirvana.scienceontheweb.net/evolution.htm http://pigs.freehyperspace.com/evolution.htm http://parasitism.about.tc/evolution.htm http://parasitism.xphost.org/evolution.htm http://rubik.hits.io/evolution.htm http://tornado.99k.org/evolution.htm http://wszewilki.greatnow.com/evolution.htm
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak ------------------------------------------------
Your posts are inspirational.
Day Brown - 20 Apr 2008 02:16 GMT > Your posts are inspirational. 18th century Bengalese Saint Ramprasad said that everything you see is part of "a projected matrix out of the mind of Kali". He thot the prime deity was female.
But he went on to say that there are a myriad worlds, so there prolly are some that are just as you think. As to how long they have existed, that depends on who getsta define time. I dont see why we have to accept your definition.
janpajak@gmail.com - 21 Apr 2008 02:07 GMT ...
> 18th century Bengalese Saint Ramprasad said that everything you see is > part of "a projected matrix out of the mind of Kali". He thot the > prime deity was female. ...
> I dont see why we have to accept your definition. Well, it is NOT my intention to make you accept my definition. I am presenting my ideas here so that you can examine them and thu8s arrive to your own conclusions. In turn what your conclusions are, it is NOT my bussiness but your personal matter. The point is, as I tried to explain it before, that we only should make sure that "all points of view have equal rights" - this should include views disseminated by "believers in God" to which I classify myself. After all, lately the views of "believers in God" are suppressed, scoffed at, ridiculed, etc., by so-called "atheists". Thus practically views of "beleivers in God" are almost NOT represented in the official human science. About the time to correct this mistake, because "all views must be equal", and NO person should be persecuted or offended for the views that he or she adheres to.
Now returning to my claim that the most vital component of God has attributes of a female, it originates from the analysis of properties of this component. This component is actually a "huge natural program" - by Christianity called the "Holy Ghost". In turn a natural program displays all atributes of a "monopolar field" which is a blueprint for feminity. So the "Holy Ghost" - which is the main carrier of the power of God to think logically and to create, is actually a kind of "monopolar field or program" which represents the essence of feminity. However, there are two further components of God, namely the Christian "God Father" and "God Son", both of which represent dipolar fields. This God Father is actually a kind of "liquid computer" - similarly is "God Son" which is a material form made of this "liquid computer" plus programs that control it. Thus, these two other components of God are actually "males" as they represent the essence of "masculity" - means represent a "dipolar field". Anyway, all this information is provided on the totaliztic web page namedf "god.htm", which also can be accessed and viewed at addresses that were listed before.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Tokay Pino Gris - 21 Apr 2008 03:25 GMT > ... >> 18th century Bengalese Saint Ramprasad said that everything you see is [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > explain it before, that we only should make sure that "all points of > view have equal rights" Oh goodie. This sounds like another mix up of "free speech" and "scientific method".
You see, in science, you have to show evidence for what you say and what you say has to be in accordance with what is know before that OR explain and/or show why what we previously thought is wrong.
- this should include views disseminated by
> "believers in God" to which I classify myself. After all, lately the > views of "believers in God" are suppressed, scoffed at, ridiculed, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > and NO person should be persecuted or offended for the views that he > or she adheres to. See? Science is not about "points of view". It's about evidence and what theories explain the evidence. [1]
You can SAY all you want, but unless you have evidence for your "theory" (in this case "wild guess" fits the mark better) it is not science.
Unless you have evidence that is in accordance with your "point of view" NOT "all views must be equal". FAR from that. If your "point of view" has no evidence and data that supports it, it has no place in science.
So, of COURSE the "theory" (I cringe to use that word in this context) that the world is 6000 years old is ridiculed. Not just by atheists, by the way. By educated theists as well. Because there is NO data that supports this claim.
The scientific method is not about free speech. Oh, you can say all you like, that the sun is dragged over the sky by three horses and such. But it is not science.
> Now returning to my claim that the most vital component of God has > attributes of a female, it originates from the analysis of properties [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > of God to think logically and to create, is actually a kind of > "monopolar field or program" which represents the essence of feminity. Ehm. You can of course give your alleged thingy all the attributes you like. But don't expect anyone to call it science.
I could just as well say that the mullabulalonga has three ears and that is because it just has one leg. Of course I can SAY that. But since there is no evidence that even suggests that a mullabulalonga even exists, all attributes I attach to it are fiction. And NOT science. (btw. I just actually googled "mullabulalonga" just to be sure)
> However, there are two further components of God, namely the Christian > "God Father" and "God Son", both of which represent dipolar fields. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > on the totaliztic web page namedf "god.htm", which also can be > accessed and viewed at addresses that were listed before. Oh, feel free to say that. As long as you don't call it "science".
The scientific method is quite strict. If you follow the rules and can actually prove what you say, you WILL get it into the science classes. In cases it might take some time, but there is no way around it.
Just, so far, no evidence WHATSOEVER even hints at a god (and I DID and DO ask for it), so what attributes you attach to this entity is beside the point. The premise is missing and so this is just another mullabulalonga with three ears.
Tokay
[1] I am freely quoting from a youtube video that explains this stuff quite well. http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=3901038854823043736&q=creationist+laugh&t otal=384&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0&hl=de
 Signature Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, and a dark side, and it holds the universe together ...
Carl Zwanzig
janpajak@gmail.com - 21 Apr 2008 05:23 GMT ...
> You see, in science, you have to show evidence for what you say and what > you say has to be in accordance with what is know before that OR explain > and/or show why what we previously thought is wrong. ... I already presented my evidence for the existence of God. You could see it at the beginning of this thread, as well as on numerous other threads that I autorised - for example have a look at the thread http://groups.google.com/group/sci.logic/browse_thread/thread/3511120c588e0a16/6 c4ba1babcee49b5#6c4ba1babcee49b5 for my formal scientific proof completed with methods of mathematical logic that "God does exist", or the thread http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/0b85905d2dc9f083 #c374dc041f3c5fdf for various items of physical evidence for the existence of God, or the thread http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origins/browse_thread/thread/8040cef26d37261 f#de22942cb8fe3aee for numerous items of the biological evidence that God does exit, or the thread http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/20892864b7f7690e /bbdc5b3dc1aed298#bbdc5b3dc1aed298 which proves that otherwise to all these countless items of scientific evidence for the existence of God, the present science is unable to show even a shred of evidence that God does NOT exist.
However, contrary to this overwhelming evidence for the existence of God, you still seem to argue that "God does NOT exist". I do respect your view. After all, you have the right to believe in whatever you wish - including that the Earth is flat and that the Moon is made of a cheese. The point is that you have the right to make your own opinion, but NOT to prevent the access of other people from access to the truth and to the evidence about God. My goal is to only make sure that you, as well as all other people, have facts available when you (or they) make up your mind and opinion. So that your opinion is an "informed one" - NOT just a guess.
The reason why I insist in making this evidence available to interested people is that previously NO scientific evidence for the existence of God was allowed to be disseminated amongst people. So people had NO chance for making an "informed decision" in matters of God. Thus, a lot of people become "atheists" only because they were misled by scientists and by this lack of information. In turn becoming an "athist" IS having various negative consequences - thus if someone becomes an "atheist", he or she should take this "dangerous path to nowhere" on the basis of an "informed decision", not just on basis of being "tricked" into it by other atheists or badly informed scientists.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Tokay Pino Gris - 21 Apr 2008 06:11 GMT > ... >> You see, in science, you have to show evidence for what you say and what [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > for my formal scientific proof completed with methods of mathematical > logic that "God does exist", or the thread Yes. I actually read that. Basic proposition 1: a.) "Genetic code displays all attributes of intelligent codes"
Prove that. A code, yes. Intelligent? How?
b.) Shannons Theory does not exactly say that.
Basic proposition 2: "[...] required the work of either superior being of a supernatural knowledge, power, and efficiency of God, or a multitude of unanimously cooperating with each other human- like intelligent beings of capabilities and efficiencies similar to these of humans."
Bullshit. Non sequitur OR unbased assumption.
Basic proposition 3? A non sequitur.
And so on.....
> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/0b85905d2dc9f083 #c374dc041f3c5fdf > for various items of physical evidence for the existence of God, or I just pick out one: 8. Telepathy [...]Therefore physicists refuse to research telepathy.[..]
False. It WAS researched and found not to work.
Also a lot of non sequiturs in there.
> the thread http://groups.google.com/group/talk.origins/browse_thread/thread/8040cef26d37261 f#de22942cb8fe3aee > for numerous items of the biological evidence that God does exit, or Oh yeah! "Genetic code. As we already know jolly well, genetic code is a kind of language. In turn every language can be formed only if it is formulated by some intelligence."
non sequitur....
Oh boy. And it goes on like this. Quite a funky list of "evidence".
Either it's non sequitur or "looks like".
> the thread http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics/browse_thread/thread/20892864b7f7690e /bbdc5b3dc1aed298#bbdc5b3dc1aed298 > which proves that otherwise to all these countless items of scientific > evidence for the existence of God, the present science is unable to > show even a shred of evidence that God does NOT exist. Oh, not that one again? You can't prove a negative.
> However, contrary to this overwhelming evidence for the existence of > God, you still seem to argue that "God does NOT exist". Since all that above (as far as I scanned it) is either non sequitur or word tricks or "looks like" arguments....
Besides, I don't "argue" that god does not exist, I ASSUME the null hypothesis that "there are no gods".
I do respect
> your view. After all, you have the right to believe in whatever you > wish - including that the Earth is flat and that the Moon is made of a [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > make up your mind and opinion. So that your opinion is an "informed > one" - NOT just a guess. Good idea. Sadly, this stuff you linked to does not qualify as scientific evidence.
> The reason why I insist in making this evidence available to > interested people is that previously NO scientific evidence for the > existence of God was allowed to be disseminated amongst people. Since it ISN'T scientific evidence...
It's either a non sequitur or word tricks or "looks like". None of which are scientific evidence.
So
> people had NO chance for making an "informed decision" in matters of > God. Thus, a lot of people become "atheists" only because they were [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > being "tricked" into it by other atheists or badly informed > scientists. Hey, if you HAVE scientific evidence, propose it. Not the mumbo-jumbo above, though.
Tokay
 Signature Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side, and a dark side, and it holds the universe together ...
Carl Zwanzig
janpajak@gmail.com - 22 Apr 2008 00:34 GMT ...
> Hey, if you HAVE scientific evidence, propose it. Not the mumbo-jumbo > above, though. ... Well, in the Polish language there ios a proverb "if you wish to hit a dog, you always find a stick". What it means is that if you disagree with something you can always "take from the ceiling" various arguments to the contrary. However, I would like you compare my proof and my evidence, e.g. with the proof and with the evidence for the existence of so-called "big bang" which is one of contr-arguments of the science against God. You will find that this "big bang" does NOT have anything in support, yet still you do NOT seem to rubbish it.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Free Lunch - 22 Apr 2008 00:39 GMT >... >> Hey, if you HAVE scientific evidence, propose it. Not the mumbo-jumbo [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >With the totaliztic salute, >Jan Pajak We cannot compare them. The Big Bang is a discovery of science. Your claims are not.
Tokay Pino Gris - 22 Apr 2008 15:27 GMT > ... >> Hey, if you HAVE scientific evidence, propose it. Not the mumbo-jumbo [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > the science against God. You will find that this "big bang" does NOT > have anything in support, yet still you do NOT seem to rubbish it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang
Read and learn.
Tokay
 Signature Man's mind, once stretched by a new idea, never regains its original dimensions.
Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.
janpajak@gmail.com - 23 Apr 2008 02:38 GMT ...
> Read and learn. ... Well, on the totaliztic web page "dipolar_gravity.htm" (see item #D2 in there) I have proven conclusively, that the supposed evidence for the "big bang" is actually the evidence for the "dipolar chcracter of gravitational field" - means the evidence for the actual NON-EXISTENCE (lack) of the "big bang". In turn you wish me to revisit this errornoeus evidence. So I would also suggest that you "read and learn" or rather "open your mind - because your knowledge is a bit out of date".
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
adman - 23 Apr 2008 22:09 GMT On Apr 23, 2:27 am, Tokay Pino Gris <tokay.gris.b...@gmx.net> wrote: ...
> Read and learn. ... Well, on the totaliztic web page "dipolar_gravity.htm" (see item #D2 in there) I have proven conclusively, that the supposed evidence for the "big bang" is actually the evidence for the "dipolar chcracter of gravitational field" - means the evidence for the actual NON-EXISTENCE (lack) of the "big bang". In turn you wish me to revisit this errornoeus evidence. So I would also suggest that you "read and learn" or rather "open your mind - because your knowledge is a bit out of date".
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
Excellent work Jan
Cory Albrecht - 23 Apr 2008 23:04 GMT >> <janpajak@gmail.com> wrote in message >> news:b9c3ff67-4cb7-4d29-af19-23c6a60c9b64@34g2000hsh.googlegroups.com... [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Excellent work Jan Did you know that Jan also believes that one can construct a pyramid power hat to increase one's telepathy, that invisible aliens occupy earth and that telekinetic batteries can provide free energy? <http://www.scribd.com/doc/2352/ebook-Dr-Jan-Pajak-Thought-Pyramid>
Jan is, simply put, a kook of the first order, thought admittedly he is far politer than the run of the mill kook.
janpajak@gmail.com - 24 Apr 2008 04:24 GMT ...
> Did you know that Jan also believes that one can construct a pyramid > power hat to increase one's telepathy, that invisible aliens occupy [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Jan is, simply put, a kook of the first order, thought admittedly he is > far politer than the run of the mill kook.- Hide quoted text - ... YES, true, I have also proven formally that "UFOs do exist". This formal proof for the existence of UFOs you can find in subsection P2 from volume 13 of my monograph [1/4] "Advanced magnetic devices" - you can download this monograph free of charge from the totaliztic web page "text_1_4.htm". Further evidence in support of the formal proof for the existence of UFOs (and for the existence of "evil UFOnauts" which for thousands of years secretly exploit our civilisation) is provided on the totaliztic web pages named "evil.htm" and "evidence.htm" - all of which can be run from any address listed in my previous posts just by replacing the page-name in this address with the required page-name. It is nothing unusual to have an open mind for everything, not just for the existence of God or for the non-existence of the "big bang". I also believe that if other scientists would have a bit more open minds, our world would NOT land in such bad shape as we see it now around ourselves. After all, we know from history that everything at some stage being scoffed at and spitted, some time later was implemented and worked (works) for the good of our civilisation. E.g. we remeber how Scientific American published a sacientific article that "heave than air flying machines are impossible" at the same time when first airplanes were already build in America. We also remember how English scientists scoffed at Wilkinson when he proposed the construction of boats made of steel - as in minds of these scientists supposedly "nothing of steel could float". (Similar examples of close-mindness of so-called "scientists" we can quote in dozens.) So all these close-minders ones who only are able to scoff and spit at everything - please open your minds and you will see things that now you do NOT believe these can exist.
With the totaliztic salute, Jan Pajak
P.S. Regarding "telepathy" - means "speach-like sonic waves that propagate in the counter-world", I would advice to have a look at the totaliztic web page "telepathy.htm". (This counter-world is another worls populated by God and by our souls. The formal proof for the existence of this counter-world is provided on the thread http://groups.google.com/group/sci.logic/browse_thread/thread/9d7e62b9be872ac3/2 d70a1621314beb6#2d70a1621314beb6 .)
adman - 23 Apr 2008 22:05 GMT | > ... | >> Hey, if you HAVE scientific evidence, propose it. Not the mumbo-jumbo [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] | | Tokay There is nothing to learn, but speculation. The Big Bang relies on a singularity which defies physics and so far there is no unifying theory.
svb1963@hotmail.co.uk - 24 Apr 2008 10:06 GMT <snipping>
> There is nothing to learn, but speculation. > The Big Bang relies on a singularity which defies physics and so far there > is no unifying theory. Quite easy to understand really, from looking at the light from other galaxies turned out that nearly all were rushing away from each other (think doppler effect but with light instead of sound - redder than normal means moving away).
Tiny bit of logic, if right now they're getting further apart, in the past they must have been closer together and if you go far enough backwards.......
janpajak@gmail.com - 26 Apr 2008 04:19 GMT On Apr 24, 9:06 pm, svb1...@hotmail.co.uk wrote: ...
> Quite easy to understand really, from looking at the light from other > galaxies turned out that nearly all were rushing away from each other [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > past they must have been closer together and if you go far enough > backwards... WELL, what colour would have the light of stars then (i.e. "in the past they must have been closer together and if you go far enough backwards...")?
The above "evidence" in the form of the "red shift" in the light of stars, is good for small children, but NOT for rationally thinkingt people. For example, why all stars display this "red shift" - if the "big bang" would in fact occur, then some stars should have a "red shift" , while some other stars should have an opposite effect (as some stars would then move in our direction). The explaionation for this so-called "red shift" is actually completely different - as provided in item #D2 of the totaliztic web page "dipolar_gravity.htm". Namely, if the light propagates in the direction opposite to the gravitational pull, it creates the "red shift". In turn, when the light propagates along the gravitational pull, then it produces the "blue shift". This is why the sky above the Earth is blue, while light of all stars is red - the stronger the gravity, the more red the light is. In other words, the whole idea of a "big bang" is a pseudo- scientific rubbish inveted by people who cannot think rationally. There was never such thing as the "big bang" in the universe! There is also NO scientific evidence which would support the idea of the "big bang"!
With the totalitztic salute, Jan Pajak
Free Lunch - 19 Apr 2008 04:54 GMT >... >> **Prove the present world is going down. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >hand, it is enough to look around us and see what happens with the >present civilisation. No it is not. You are demonstrating a frightening ignorance of the past.
>Immorality, pesimism, devaluation, unemployment, >hunger, wars, etc., etc. All these represent items of evidence that >the above does NOT even need to be proven, and still is true. And nothing about that has anything at all to do with gods. If it does, it only goes to show that the god you claim exists does not do anything. Of course, it does not because your assertions do not fit actual history. Your list has always existed with minor sad variations. Clearly, you would prefer to be whining about the evil that men do today than have been somewhere that real evil was being done, say 65 years ago, or any other of many times that were far, far worse than this century.
>With the totaliztic salute, >Jan Pajak Hasn't Poland suffered enough totalitarian salutes?
Free Lunch - 19 Apr 2008 04:47 GMT >... >> Guess why? It is scoffable, choke worthy, and ridiculous. What else [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >hand, it is well known that every present atheist does NOT know how to >act morally. Ah, yes, the totally unsupported accusation made by religionists because religionists claim that they are moral no matter what evil they do. If they murder it is God's will. If they steal, it is God's will. If they rape or terrorize or engage in any despicable act, they are being moral because God demands that they act in such a manner.
>So atheists can only swear, spit, scoff, and do whatever >immoral they learned to do, at all logical and scientific arguments [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >With the totaliztic salute, >Jan Pajak Scientists have already discovered many things that prove such nonsense to be false. What rational discussion is there to engage in? Please tell me.
Of course, the world is not going down. Life for most humans is better than it ever was in history, though people who are offended by reality have been whining about how the world is going to hell in a handbasket, or variations, for thousands of years.
panamfloyd@hotmail.com - 16 Apr 2008 22:36 GMT On Apr 16, 2:33 am, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects > which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar > substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. For > example, let us consider attributes of such "holy" substances and > objects, as: 1.) Kitsune statues at shrines:
http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&q=kitsune+statues&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wi
2.) Straight beam and curved beam torii:
http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/shrine-guide-2.shtml#gate http://www.aisf.or.jp/~jaanus/deta/t/torii.htm
3.) Misogi harai:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o68qETSMQpU
You've convinced me. I am no longer an atheist. Inari is God. Happy Harvest an' lots o' babies, y'all!!
Didn't work out quite the way you planned, did it, you moron?
-Panama Floyd, Atlanta. aa#2015/KoBAAWA! "..the prayer cloth of one aeon is the doormat of the next." -Mark Twain
Religious societies are *less* moral than secular ones: http://moses.creighton.edu/JRS/2005/2005-11.html
Richo - 22 Apr 2008 00:54 GMT On Apr 16, 4:33 pm, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:
> A rather extraordinary class of scientific evidence for the existence > of God, is the difference between attributes of substances or objects > which in past were called "holy", and attributes of other similar > substances or objects which were NOT considered to be holy. The distinction between Holy and profane is purely in the "mind of the beholder". Totally subjective. What is holy to one person is just an ordinary object or substance to a non believer.
Holiness (or Divinity for that matter) is not *intrinsic* to any object or substance it exists only as a relationship between the believer and the thing or substance. Saying "X" is holy is meaningless unless you specify to whom "X" is holy.
Here endeth the lesson.
Cheers, Mark.
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