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Natural Science Forum / Earth Science / Oceanography / August 2006Cataclism, good translation?
Dear All, In sight of 'tsunamis' and some research on the greek word of cataclysm, I was trying to understand or get a good translation of this word. 'flood' is not a good translation, since floods occur everywhere eg. near rivers. But cataclism, seems a violent everything destroying wave. What's your opinion about this? >Dear All, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >What's your opinion about this? "deluge" might be the word you'd prefer to "flood" "cataclysm" would by extension describe an impact/bolide event, a supervolcano eruption, an ice age, etc.--a natural disaster of biblical proportions >>Dear All, >> [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > "deluge" might be the word you'd prefer to "flood" It might be, but the Dutch translation would be 'vloed' that is 'flood'. > "cataclysm" would by extension describe an impact/bolide event, a > supervolcano eruption, an ice age, etc.--a natural disaster of > biblical proportions You know, I just give up. I've tried the Dutch language specialists as well, there is no such word that really translates the *meaning* of cataclism. Sure, there is a translation, but that is based on tradition, not on what the ancient greek, really understood. Personally, I believe the deluge was 'tsunamis' so, not one but hundreds, thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the continents (where the atlantic ocean is currently). > > "cataclysm" would by extension describe an impact/bolide event, a > > supervolcano eruption, an ice age, etc.--a natural disaster of [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the > continents (where the atlantic ocean is currently). Are you referring to the flood that the bible says occured some 4 or 5 thousand years ago? Try Kataklu or Katakluzo. A cleansing overflow. A small flood, fast enough, will knock a man over if it is only ankle high. Pictures of the tidal wave that killed all those people in December 2004, don't show much of a tide. But tides have very little range in that area AFAIK. >It might be, but the Dutch translation would be 'vloed' that is 'flood'. Of course, I had no idea you were looking for a Dutch word. >You know, I just give up. I've tried the Dutch language specialists as well, >there is no such word that really translates the *meaning* of cataclism. >Sure, there is a translation, but that is based on tradition, not on what >the ancient greek, really understood. And you know what the ancient Greeks "really understood" how, exactly? >Personally, I believe the deluge was 'tsunamis' so, not one but hundreds, >thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the >continents (where the atlantic ocean is currently). Your English here has lost me. >>It might be, but the Dutch translation would be 'vloed' that is 'flood'. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > And you know what the ancient Greeks "really understood" how, exactly? Why do you think I 'know' that while I'm asking this? >>Personally, I believe the deluge was 'tsunamis' so, not one but hundreds, >>thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the >>continents (where the atlantic ocean is currently). > > Your English here has lost me. I don't know whether your're UK or US english-speaking, but some people are quick to state that someone's english sucks. The original flood, was caused by europe+africa and the americas being torn in two parts. There's evidence. When the oceans ruled the country, huge ocean waves must have ruled over the earth. Causing the know known deluvian fossile record. >>It might be, but the Dutch translation would be 'vloed' that is 'flood'. > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > And you know what the ancient Greeks "really understood" how, exactly? Why do you think I 'know' that while I'm asking this? >>Personally, I believe the deluge was 'tsunamis' so, not one but hundreds, >>thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the >>continents (where the atlantic ocean is currently). > > Your English here has lost me. I don't know whether your're UK or US english-speaking, but some people are quick to state that someone's english sucks. The original flood, was caused by europe+africa and the americas being torn in two parts. There's evidence. When the oceans ruled the world, huge ocean waves must have ruled over the earth. Causing the known deluvian fossile record. >>>You know, I just give up. I've tried the Dutch language specialists as >>>well, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Why do you think I 'know' that while I'm asking this? Your wording--"There is a translation, but that is based on tradition, not on what the ancient greek, really understood"--implies that you know precisely how ancient Greeks defined their word for "cataclysm." >>>Personally, I believe the deluge was 'tsunamis' so, not one but hundreds, >>>thousands of tsunamis because of earthquakes, and the split between the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >I don't know whether your're UK or US english-speaking, but some people are >quick to state that someone's english sucks. I said that I was unable to understand your English, not that it sucked. Further, my inability to understand your response has nothing to do with the small differences in spelling & diction between British English & American English (each of which is widely understandable to native speakers of the other). As best as I can make out, it seems you believe that the continents broke apart somehow in great, wrenching paroxysms (or cataclysms?), generating tsunamis which flooded the land. >The original flood, was caused by europe+africa and the americas being torn >in two parts. There's evidence. When the oceans ruled the world, huge >ocean waves must have ruled over the earth. Causing the known deluvian >fossile record. Cool! >>>>You know, I just give up. I've tried the Dutch language specialists as >>>>well, [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > not on what the ancient greek, really understood"--implies that you > know precisely how ancient Greeks defined their word for "cataclysm." You got a point but let me explain. There are 3 different words in the koine greek bible, all translated into flood. That's why I hesitate, and I suspect that this is a typical case, where detailed knowledge on ancient languages have been lost. The words are 'potamos', 'kataklismos', and seismos (on the water). Since much bibles all translate a different way, I assume that nobody really knows. > There are 3 different words in the koine greek bible, all translated into > flood. That's why I hesitate, and I suspect that this is a typical case, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Since much bibles all translate a different way, I assume that nobody really knows. The actual text explainining the cause of the flood alledges that it was the completion of the water cycle that caused rain to fall. The reason that god allowed it to become a catastrphe is not explained in a scientific sense. ross references were produced by people like Young, who wrote a concordance for the King James' bible. (With the setting up of the Church of England the only book available day or night to the common people in Britain and its colonies was tha KJ version. Henry the Eigth had passed a law that all Cof E churches should carry one freely available and that the churches should remain open 24/7. By the time of Thomas Young, many British people prided themselves on their ability to quote huge chunks of that version. Rather like the parrots Christ castigated for their similar abilities in his day, they had a form of knowledge that lackked only undestanding. No doubtYoung Thos may have had it in mind to clear up a few errors. Perhaps you might find help with the problem you posed, there.) By the early 20th century, a small group of scholars produced a translation of the analysed script of the collected texts. The idea being that the errors or discrepancies between the received translations might be averaged out. Serious translations in the modern languages based on this version of the bible have footnotes and annotations to explain the variances. You can no doubt get hold of one of these either from your main library of from a religious source near you. |
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