The Brilliance of Our Teacherst
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Mapssiwq - 13 Sep 2004 14:40 GMT The Brilliance of Our Teachers A recent newspaper question and answer column raised an interesting subject. The query noted that, for a science course at a local school, there were two instructors. One of those instructors explained the concepts clearly and his students did well on standardized tests. The other instructor's teachings were scattered and his students performed poorly. The students, however, believed that the second instructor was brilliant and thought that his explanations are simply over their heads. The query went on to ask why such a misperception occurred.
The answer given was that both groups were easily misled into believing that mysterious people are highly intelligent. When those listeners heard material they didn't grasp, they assumed that the fault was theirs and not the teachers. And, since the listeners considered themselves fairly intelligent, it was obvious that the teacher must be brilliant! (Lest there be a misunderstanding, the reference is not to High School Teachers teaching adolescents, it is to Graduate School Professors teaching PhD candidates.)
Judging from the material posted in these Newsgroups, the effect would seem to be quite pronounced. It is quite plain that the posters ardently believe in the validity of what they have been taught. It is also quite obvious that they are aware, if only sublimely, of the inconsistencies and contradictions within that teaching. If that were not the case, the subject matter would be straightforward by now, the understanding of modern physics would not be so muddled, and the postings would not suggest such a high level of misunderstanding.
The truth of the matter is that the subjects, relativity in particular, seem mysterious and contradictory for one basic reason. The teachers of the subject do not themselves understand it. Because they don't understand the subject they hide behind sophisticated, often unnecessary and sometimes self contradictory mathematical explanations to prevent that lack of understanding from being apparent. In order to achieve this goal they have made Physics into the only Science where MECHANISM is not considered. This is illustrated by a quotation from Dr. Hawking who exclaimed, in an interview, that he was only interested in mathematics and observation and in the correlation of the two approaches. He didn't care about "reality" (for which we may read mechanism) because he didn't know what reality was. This is unfortunate because the present practice of ignoring mechanism, and overlooking the fact that nothing is known until observation, mathematics and understanding of mechanism are in agreement. Without such an agreement an understanding of the process(es) involved is not assured. It is only when all three requirements have been met that we can have any hope of knowing "who is doing what to whom".
Even more important, without including mechanism in our understanding matrix, we eliminate a vital check on validity. The mathematics of many processes extends to regions which are physically unrealizable. Without considering mechanism these "empty" regions will not be recognized. An example of the effect is the idea that "virtual photons" can explain forces which act at a distance. "Virtual photons" can easily explain repulsive forces acting between material particles, but they can not be used to explain attractive forces. The same is true of "gravitons". They cannot produce the attractive force of gravity! "Virtual particles" can only produce repulsive forces. An understanding "mechanism" reveals this deficiency quite clearly.
To put the relativity concepts into perspective, the current orthodoxy accepts the validity of the idea that there are no absolutes. Length is what yardsticks measure and time is what clocks measure. What is conveniently overlooked is that the forces existing between the atoms in a yardstick and the hairspring of a clock escapement (or their conceptual equivalents in actual test equipment) must be electromagnetic in nature. Not only is electromagnetism the only known candidate for these forces, the need for them follows if the questionable idea of modern physics that interatomic forces are produced by the exchange of "virtual photons" is not to collapse instantaneously. In addition, the speed of a clock is affected by the mass of its balance wheel (or equivalent) as given by M=E/C^2 and the stiffness of the forces between the nuclei of the "hairspring" (or equivalent). Since all of the preceding are functions of the velocity of light in the local reference frame, it is rather foolish to make the assertion that length is what yardsticks measure and time is what clocks measure without taking into account the effect that possible changes in the actual velocity of light might have on them. Such changes may be concealed by relativistically induced changes in the atomic spacings, stiffnesses and inertial masses of our instruments When one does take these considerations into account, the Principle of Relativity and the invariance of the local velocity of light follow at once for the simple reason that matter must be using the local "en vacuo" velocity of light to control its parameters. A physicist who does not recognize this instinctively is clearly in the wrong line of work. (I understand Wal-Mart is hiring.). One does not need to resort to the sophisticated and to a large degree defective teachings of an arrogant intellectual elite Once the basics are recognized, the understanding of the process involved do not require advanced mathematics, they are within the capabilities of a bright high school physics student.
The source material for this posting may be found in "Gravity" (1987), "The Einstein Hoax" (1997), and "Corrections to Residual Errors in Special Relativity (1999) located at http://www.members.aol.com/einsteinhoax/site.htm . EVERYTHING WHICH WE ACCEPT AS TRUE MUST BE CONSISTENT WITH EVERYTHING ELSE WE HAVE ACCEPTED AS TRUE, IT MUST BE CONSISTENT WITH ALL OBSERVATIONS, AND IT MUST BE MATHEMATICALLY VIABLE. PRESENT TEACHINGS DO NOT ALWAYS MEET THIS REQUIREMENT. THE WORLD IS ENTITLED TO A HIGHER STANDARD OF WORKMANSHIP FROM THOSE IT HAS GRANTED WORLD CLASS STATUS.
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Paul Draper - 15 Sep 2004 18:28 GMT > The Brilliance of Our Teachers > <snip>
> The answer given was that both groups were easily misled into believing > that mysterious people are highly intelligent. When those listeners heard [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > misunderstanding, the reference is not to High School Teachers teaching > adolescents, it is to Graduate School Professors teaching PhD candidates.) A superb physicist (Feynman) also once said that if you can't explain something in a way that your grandmother would understand it, then you don't understand it. Whether students feel the same way about the person doing the explaining is, in my opinion, immaterial.
<snip>
> The truth of the matter is that the subjects, relativity in particular, > seem mysterious and contradictory for one basic reason. The teachers of the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > approaches. He didn't care about "reality" (for which we may read mechanism) > because he didn't know what reality was. A really good physicist understands the value of both physical intuition (what you call MECHANISM) and rigorous formalism, and uses one to check against the weaknesses of the other all the time. A conceptual picture can turned into definite, experimental predictions with the aid of a mathematical construction and a following calculation. Otherwise, something that seems to be plausible conceptually can turn out to be ruled out after calculation. Likewise, a mathematical construction can look quite pretty, but if it doesn't have a conceptual underpinning or rationale that makes physical sense, then it's just a construction without basis in reality. The problem is, with which approach do you reach forward when you are at the edge of knowledge? Which comes first, the formalism or the conceptual insight? Hawking is saying that, where he is working, the mathematics is more reliable than physical intuition for reaching forward. However, that doesn't mean that the mathematical model won't be held up to conceptual verification at some point.
Your insistence that virtual particles cannot "pull" is due to an unwillingness to use both tools, math and insight, to figure out whether that's really true -- much the same way that many, when SR suggested that space and time are not really distinct, thought to themselves, "Rubbish. Of course they're distinct."
PD
Plehqw - 16 Sep 2004 15:05 GMT Your analysis is faulty. Mathematics is only useful to analyze a postulated mechanism. Without such a postulate, the mathematics are meaningless. They cannot be used as a lead mechanism.
As to your assertion that mathematical treatments can explaiin how "virtual photons" can produce an attractive force, it is clear that you have never understood physics. They cannot produce an attractive force because the momentum exchange is wrong. Their only legitimate role is analogous to the virtual force which allows a bicycle to be ridden. Just as the bicycle requires the "virtual force" to be applied to the substrate represented by the road, the force exerted by "virtual photons" requires a substrate such as the classical Aether for them to apply their forces. In both cases the substrate supplies the actual forces.
It is very tedious to reply to people like yourself who hgave never really learned physics and who have been deluded into thinking that mathematics is a substitute. It is even more tedious to be lectured by fools like yourself!
Einsteinhhoax@aol.com
Paul Draper - 16 Sep 2004 20:05 GMT I'm going to respond, though my initial reaction is not to. I don't normally respond to those who accuse complete strangers of being fools and make assumptions about their understanding and/or training in physics. Courtesy and human-to-human manners will, in the end, be more important to your legacy than your ideas about physics, I'll predict. I think you can do better, and I'd ask you to try with me.
I believe you are wrong that mathematics can only help once you have a postulated mechanism. In practice -- and I do mean "how it's done" -- theorists will start with a postulated mechanism, find a mathematical tool that allows them to make firm predictions and to make a rigorous structure to avoid making mistakes. But then, just as likely, the mathematic tool will be linked to a related mathematical result or tool, and the physicist will ask, "Can this other bit of related math tell me something about the physics that I didn't see before?" And this is how physical intuition can spring from the math. As long as the intuition is verifiable, there is nothing wrong with this approach. I never, never said that mathematics is a substitute for physical intuition. I only said that it is often as powerful a tool, and that the two of them are effectively used in tandem, often one bootstrapping the other, when doing good, solid research.
I'm telling you, this is how it's done, and it works. You may say it's foolishness to do so, and then the argument dissolves not into what physics is correct or incorrect, but what is the right way to do science? If this is what you're really after, then perhaps you should demonstrate, in multiple disciplines, why it's not a consistent way to approach it. Be careful! The act of doing science is a method, not a truth in itself. If you say that your approach is a priori the correct way, then you've accomplished nothing.
As for your example of riding a bicycle, I think I know what forces are involved, and there are no virtual forces required at all. First, you'll have to define for me what you think a virtual force is, and why they would have value in explaining something as simple as riding a bike (as opposed to real, tangible, object-acting-on-object, forces), and for that matter what the virtual force is. The force acting between the tire of a bike and the road is the contact force between them, sometimes broken up into the "normal" (meaning "perpendicular) force that prevents mutual penetration, and friction that results in the forward motion.
PD
10of100 - 21 Sep 2004 16:52 GMT I think what you've written shows us the pitfalls of being human, as living beings we tend to be very subjective. A scientist, to be effective at uncovering hidden facts, has to limit his or hers subjective tendencies as much as possible and let the "results speak for themselves" or end up with results that are skewed and worthless. As anyone can tell, sci.physics forums show us alot about what is worthless. Many of the theories that modern physics rely on have been tested, time and again, and the ones that we have today, ahve passed the tests given it. Yet most effective scientist will know, even those who we call "Great", that their theory may be disproven at any moment as our collective knowledge grows and new facts are discovered. The point with what Hawkings was implying about reality. Reality is defined by our senses, which typicaly means "our perception is our reality" which is very subjective. I can understand why he would want to leave it out.
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