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Natural Science Forum / Physics / General Physics / July 2008Does Relativity generate more heat than light?
I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis the utility of the various physical models, that they take a look around and note what models are used every day to make life better for mankind. On the other hand, if anyone wants to analysis what physical models generate more heat than light, and what models are hyped by people on the public payroll, and people motivated by race and religion, I suggest that they that a look at what models are hyped by the mass media, and what models are hyped and countered in the newsgroups. As can be seen, models such as Newton's Laws, the DNA model, Ohm's Law, Kirchoff's Laws, thermodynamics, etc. are used every day, and there is no hyping or worshipping of these models, and no debate on their utility. Considering that the only claim to the utility of General Relativity is the false claim that it was and is essential to the GPS system, it appears that General Relativity is a Tower of Babel, that generates more heat than light, and is hyped for race/religion glorification and taxpayer funding, rather than for it's cost-effective utility Of course, I could be wrong, and I will be looking forward to seeing any of the posters who hype General Relativity to post a few worked-outs examples showing how General Relative can be used to make life better for mankind. As is well known Newton used his model and the data collected by ships that England sent all over the world using standard pendulums to count the number of swings from sunrise to sunrise, to compute the size and shape of the Earth, and the tides at various places. Considering that it is much easier and simpler today using modern computers to duplicate Newton's work, I challenge the people who claim that General Relativity is a cost-effective, viable model, and in the same class as Newton's Model, to compute the tides at ONE place to demonstrate the viability of General Relativity. If General Relativity is such a powerful and useful model, it should be pretty simple for a General Relativity supporter to set up a computer program, enter the data Newton used, and duplicate or improve upon Newton's results. No doubt, many models can be found to predict things beyond man's capacity to measure, like the beginning and end of the universe, time travel, worm holes, dark matter, the number of angels that fit on the head of a pin, but I suggest that the value of a model to mankind rests in its' utility.  SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis > the utility of the various physical models, > > that they take a look around and note what models > are used every day to make life better for mankind. [snip crap] Idiot. Go suck up to a priest: "Hodie mihi, cras tibi". <http://www.edu-observatory.org/physics-faq/Relativity/SR/experiments.html> Experimental constraints on Special Relativity <http://relativity.livingreviews.org/Articles/lrr-2006-3/> http://arXiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0311039 Experimental constraints on General Relativity SignatureUncle Al http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/ (Toxic URL! Unsafe for children and most mammals) http://www.mazepath.com/uncleal/lajos.htm#a2 >> I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis >> the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > http://arXiv.org/abs/gr-qc/0311039 > Experimental constraints on General Relativity I was disappointed to see that Uncle Al's references were the web sites of a General Relativity Cult Leader who is on the government payroll, and the web site of the most active General Relativity Cultist in sci.physics. I was hopeful that someone could provide a comparison of the actual benefits to society of General Relativity vs. the DNA model, and to provide verifiable proof of any claims for GTR rather than parroting the false claim that GTR was and is essential to the GPS system. No doubt Clifford Wills hypes GTR because it provides him with job security, a good income, and lets him travel all over the world to attend GTR seminars at the expense of the American taxpayers, and of course, Sam Wormley hypes GTR because it helps him score with hot, young chicks who can't tell the difference between clean oats, and oats that come out of a horse's a.s. I expected more of Uncle Al as I thought he had the equipment to distinguish good oats from bad oats. It seems to me that we have some aggressive organic fertilizer salesmen at work here. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > Considering that the only claim to the utility of > General Relativity is the false claim that it [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > and is hyped for race/religion glorification and taxpayer funding, > rather than for it's cost-effective utility Potter, you certainly have misconceptions... Newton's gravitational theory didn't explain what gravitation is but does provide reasonable accuracy for calculations. GTR provides a more complete understanding of gravitation and is more accurate than Newton... orbital precession, gravitational lensing, etc. and yes, GTR predicts accurately the corrections necessary for Global Navigation Satellite Systems (GNSS). GTR is an essential tool in investigations of compact astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on! > Of course, I could be wrong, > and I will be looking forward to seeing any of the > posters who hype General Relativity to post a few > worked-outs examples showing how General Relative > can be used to make life better for mankind. Understand, in general, benefits mankind! >> Considering that the only claim to the utility of >> General Relativity is the false claim that it [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. > And so on! Sammy makes a good point! GTR provides a good understanding of "astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology" and the beginning and end of the universe ( That is if you use the GTR model to model these things and then use GTR to verify that the observations fit the GTR model.), whereas all the DNA model does is enable man to produce more and better food, improve medical care, reconstruct history, fight crime, duplicate productive plants and animals, establish innocence and guilt, etc. Thanks for this comparison Sammy! Your pal, SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm >>> Considering that the only claim to the utility of >>> General Relativity is the false claim that it [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Sammy makes a good point! Thanks Potter! I'm hoping it wasn't lost on you! > >>> Considering that the only claim to the utility of > >>> General Relativity is the false claim that it [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Thanks Potter! I'm hoping it wasn't lost on you! Just for the record, so that no one will fall for any dishonest editing, I am reposting the point that my pal Wormley made. GTR provides a good understanding of "astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology" and the beginning and end of the universe ( That is if you use the GTR model to model these things and then use GTR to verify that the observations fit the GTR model.), whereas all the DNA model does is enable man to produce more and better food, improve medical care, reconstruct history, fight crime, duplicate productive plants and animals, establish innocence and guilt, etc. -- Tom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > "Sam Wormley" <swormley1@mchsi.com> wrote in message news:TjOdk.194041$TT4.46716@attbi_s22... >> Potter, you certainly have misconceptions... >> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Sammy makes a good point! Thanks Potter! I'm hoping it wasn't lost on you! > I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis > the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > are hyped by the mass media, and what models > are hyped and countered in the newsgroups. Potter has the tolerance for fundamental research of a three-year-old who wants what he wants when he wants it, which is NOW. Delayed gratification is indefensible for Potter. And yet, his iconic role models he remembers unclearly and with rose- colored glasses. For example, Newton's laws of universal gravitation led to no interesting scientific discoveries for 180 years and no practical application until the launching of satellites nearly 300 years later, and yet Potter has no tolerance for developments for a theory that is 93 years old, and which was shelved for 30 years while quantum mechanics and nuclear physics accelerated. Gregor Mendel's work took place in the 1860's, but his work was ignored for 50 years, and it did not lead to any significant practical applications for 100 years. And yet, that fundamental work has *profound* impact on medicine, breeding, agriculture, and evolutionary biology. Yet Potter somehow does not see this as a waste of time, nor is he grievously wounded by the attention Mendel gets in textbooks, mass media, classrooms and newsgroups. I wonder how he would have felt about it in 1910 or 1920, and whether he would have felt any remorse today at being so wrong. Potter is famous for rationalizations and selective evidence-sieving. He has an agenda and is only interested in seeing that which supports his agenda. Rationalizations and selective judging is a sign of prejudice and bigotry, which Potter is also publicly famous for, and which he nevertheless projects on others. I can make a fairly confident prediction that Potter will feel compulsively *obligated* to respond with a defensive air, and will sniff that anyone who finds his view repugnant is bigoted by definition. Potter is a nutjob with WAAAAY too much time on his hands and a deep need for self-promotion and visibility. PD >"PD" <TheDraperFamily@gmail.com> wrote in message news:d72c80d1-8d3f-4a8f-90ea-e1cb0e0e09d8@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... >> I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis [quoted text clipped - 51 lines] > >PD 1687 - The Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica (now known as the Principia) 1698 - Steam engine: Thomas Savery It appears that PD prefers to attack the messenger, rather than examine why billions of dollars of the taxpayers hard-earned money are spent to rationalize General Relativity, when the time, money and minds could have been better spent on models that have proven to work, like DNA, quantum mechanics, classical mechanics, etc. rather than wasted on a non-viable auguring model that compares to astrology, in that it "augers" the "mind of God", the beginning and end of the universe, etc. and has no room for a universe inhabited by sentient beings. Note that while General Relativity is a Tower of Babel that wastes time, money and minds, the DNA model is improving food production, medicine, crime fighting and prevention, the reconstruction of history, etc. Where would you like to see your tax dollars spent, and what models would you want you children to be educated to, a Tower of Babel, auguring model, or a useful model like DNA? PD "is a <race/religion motivated> nutjob with WAAAAY too much time on his hands and a deep need for self-promotion and visibility." ( As can be seen by his intense emotional attachment to Google's five star rating system, and his use of sock puppets to cook the books.) http://sci.tech-archive.net/Archive/sci.physics/2007-08/msg01321.html A mind is a terrible thing to waste. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm [...] > >I can make a fairly confident prediction that Potter will feel > >compulsively *obligated* to respond with a defensive air, and will > >sniff that anyone who finds his view repugnant is bigoted by > >definition. [...] > It appears that PD prefers to attack the messenger, [snip blather] What's it like being typecast, crackpotter? > [...] > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > What's it like being typecast, crackpotter? Hey Gisse, considering that PD posted the personal attack quoted below, do you think I "typecast" him pretty well when I posted: " It appears that PD prefers to attack the messenger" Excerpt from PD's *****FIVE STAR***** post follows. ======================================= "Potter has the tolerance for fundamental research of a three-year- old who wants what he wants when he wants it, which is NOW. Delayed gratification is indefensible for Potter. Potter is famous for rationalizations and selective evidence-sieving. He has an agenda and is only interested in seeing that which supports his agenda. Rationalizations and selective judging is a sign of prejudice and bigotry, which Potter is also publicly famous for, and which he nevertheless projects on others. I can make a fairly confident prediction that Potter will feel compulsively *obligated* to respond with a defensive air, and will sniff that anyone who finds his view repugnant is bigoted by definition. Potter is a nutjob with WAAAAY too much time on his hands and a deep need for self-promotion and visibility. " ============================= As can be seen, I was right on target with my "typecasting" of PD. And of course, you could fill in for PD Gisse, and no one in the audience would know the difference, but you wouldn't get a *****FIVE STAR***** Google rating like PD unless you also have a few sock puppets. -- Tom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > > [...] > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > do you think I "typecast" him pretty well when I posted: > " It appears that PD prefers to attack the messenger" Defensive much, crackpotter? That isn't a personal attack - that's an objective assessment of your defective personality. > Excerpt from PD's *****FIVE STAR***** post follows. > ======================================= [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > As can be seen, > I was right on target with my "typecasting" of PD. Did you typecast him as being astute? He could not have hit the target more cleanly with that shot. > And of course, you could fill in for PD Gisse, > and no one in the audience would know the difference, Only if they are as senile as you. If you can't tell the difference between Paul and myself then I don't know what the f.ck. Paul is a lot nicer than me, with an order of magnitude more patience and subtlety than myself when it comes to morons like yourself. Notice that he never - even once - called you a blithering f.cking idiot even though it would be entirely correct. > but you wouldn't get a *****FIVE STAR***** > Google rating like PD unless you also have a few sock puppets. Why do you care about post ratings so much, crackpotter? > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > > > [...] > [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] > > -- > >Tom Potter I am sadden to see that Eric Gisse, who claims to be a high school graduate, is all bent out of shape because he thinks that his buddy PD is incapable addressing my posts. I suggest to Eric Gisse, that PD is certainly more competent to address my posts, tha some high school graduate from Alaska, who can't work simple problems that Newton worked centuries ago, without the aid of powerful digital computers. Regarding Gisse's question: "Why do you care about post ratings so much, crackpotter?" One might ask, why Gisse fantasizes that I care "so much" about Google Ratings, and one might ask, why Gisse cares "so much" about how he thinks that I feel about Google Ratings. As can be seen from the url below: http://sci.tech-archive.net/Archive/sci.physics/2007-08/msg01321.html it is PD, not I, that cares "so much" about Google ratings. And as can be seen by scanning a few of Eric Gisse's *****Five Star***** Google posts, Eric also cares so much" about Google ratings as he uses his sock puppet to give himself *****Five Star***** Google ratings on his one line vulgar posts that simply attacks some poster. -- Tom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm [snip] > I am sadden to see that Eric Gisse, > who claims to be a high school graduate, Is graduating high school _really_ something that you need to bring up nearly every time you respond to me? [snip remaining uninteresting babble, unread] > Note that while General Relativity is a Tower of Babel > that wastes time, money and minds, > the DNA model is improving food production, > medicine, crime fighting and prevention, > the reconstruction of history, etc. That seem a bit extreme. GR does fairly good at predicting where some matter has to be. The waste occurs when you try to put the matter where the theory says it should be. Then the nut-cases of the "Loyal order of the youthful twin" mount their steeds to defend their delusions. Now if you expect people who can't even spot a causality violation to do anything other than snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, then you expect far too much from the bottom 30 percent of the aggregate mass of human protoplasm. > Where would you like to see your tax dollars spent, > and what models would you want you children to be [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > WAAAAY too much time on his hands > and a deep need for self-promotion and visibility." > ( As can be seen by his intense emotional attachment to Google's > five star rating system, and his use of sock puppets to cook the books.)http://sci.tech-archive.net/Archive/sci.physics/2007-08/msg01321.html > A mind is a terrible thing to waste. Ahhh... no. ~An idle mind is the devil's workshop~ And most of the people you've mentioned elsewhere shouldn't be anywhere near any kind of work shop where sharp objects, power tools and inadaquate adult supervision is the norm. So consider it your contribution to humanity to show some tolerance for those unfortunates. Even feign some interest in their delusions if necessary. After all... They can't even hurt themselves if you can keep one of their hands glued to a keyboard and the other glued to a mouse. :o) Sue... > -- > Tom Potter > >"PD" <TheDraperFam...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:d72c80d1-8d3f-4a8f-90ea-e1cb0e0e09d8@d45g2000hsc.googlegroups.com... > >> I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > 1687 - The Philosophiae Naturalis Principia Mathematica (now known as the Principia) > 1698 - Steam engine: Thomas Savery And you are attributing the development of that steam engine to Newton's Principia? REALLY???? > It appears that PD prefers to attack the messenger, > [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > ( As can be seen by his intense emotional attachment to Google's > five star rating system, and his use of sock puppets to cook the books.)http://sci.tech-archive.net/Archive/sci.physics/2007-08/msg01321.html Oooh, and delusional too. Would it be of interest to you that I have never used a sock puppet, and that I have never ranked a single post? Or is your imaginary world more pleasing to you? > A mind is a terrible thing to waste. > > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > I suggest You fail at step zero: We do not care what you suggest. If you don't think relativity is useful - fine, that's your problem. Just don't expect science to bend over backwards to _your_ will. [snip] >>I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis >>the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 67 lines] > think relativity is useful - fine, that's your problem. Just don't > expect science to bend over backwards to _your_ will. Can I take your post to mean that you are incapable of using General Relativity to compute just ONE of the many things that Newton computed hundreds of years ago. Gisse, I am surprised that a bright high school grad like you with access to the amazing General Relativity model and powerful digital computers cannot duplicate just ONE of the many computations that Newton made with hand calculations using his primitive, inefficient model. -- Tom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >>I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis > >>the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 78 lines] > of the many computations that Newton made > with hand calculations using his primitive, inefficient model. The weak field limit replicates all of Newton, stupid. Don't challenge me on a subject you have not studied. > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > > >>I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis > > >>the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 84 lines] > > -- > >Tom Potter Can I take your post to mean that you are incapable of using General Relativity to compute just ONE of the many things that Newton computed hundreds of years ago. Gisse, I am surprised that a bright high school grad like you with access to the amazing General Relativity model and powerful digital computers cannot duplicate just ONE of the many computations that Newton made with hand calculations using his primitive, inefficient model. -- Tom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm [...] > Can I take your post to mean that you are > incapable of using General Relativity [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > of the many computations that Newton made > with hand calculations using his primitive, inefficient model. Dear Tom Potter, You are addressing a very busy man with expansive interests. Try to have a bit of patience. It is surely the same as his problem with dull and uninteresting torsion pendulums. http://farside.ph.utexas.edu/teaching/301/lectures/node139.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noether's_theorem Eric Gisse: << It isn't interesting enough for me to tackle . >> http://groups.google.com/group/sci.physics.relativity/msg/9fefdaebda39cee2?dmode =source ;-) Sue... > -- > Tom Potter > > > >>I suggest that if anyone wants to analysis > > > >>the utility of the various physical models, [quoted text clipped - 89 lines] > to compute just ONE of the many things > that Newton computed hundreds of years ago. Since I explicitly said that GR replicates all of Newton, no you cannot. > Gisse, I am surprised that a bright high school grad like you > with access to the amazing General Relativity model [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: >> Can I take your post to mean that you are >> incapable of using General Relativity >> to compute just ONE of the many things >> that Newton computed hundreds of years ago. >Since I explicitly said that GR replicates all of Newton, no you >cannot. Don't run and hide Gisse. You claim General Relativity is a useful and viable tool, and that you are proficient in its' use. All I'd like to see you do, is duplicate just ONE of the tide computations that Newton made hundreds of years ago using what you assert is an inferior model. What puzzles me is why all of the General Relativity Gurus are on the taxpayer dole, and none make a living in the free market using their powerful, esoteric knowledge. Considering that you should use the best tool for the job, I'd like to see a demonstration of what jobs General Relativity is is the best tool for, other than computing things beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space, like the beginning and end of the universe, time travel, warping through space, worm holes, etc. If the taxpayers is going to spend their hard earned dollars training high school grads like you, it seems to me that they should expect you to be taught something that can be uses to improve the lot of mankind, like DNA, etc. Back in the 1970's, the taxpayers spent a lot of money paying to teach inner city boys how to play basketball. I wonder if teaching boys GTR is a similar scheme to keep boys off the streets, or if it is a useful tool for anything. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm Relativity itself does not. The reason why it appears to is that certain anti relativists have a hidden agenda. It is all about antigravity, Roswell, ODESSA and little green men. The authour of this posting is a self confessed anti semite and holocaust denier. Does this affect the validity of what he is saying. Well, quite apart from the fact that what he and indeed everyone else in his camp is saying has no validity. Just a modicum of thought indicates this. If Relativity is true it follows that the CIA accepted war criminals into its bosom on the basis of some cock and bull story about Aldebaron, hidden forces and antigravity. In the McCarthy era the ODESSA brigade effectively took over. Oppenheimer (together with a lot of other good scientists) was ousted and relaced by "aldebaron khayyid". Don't know what that means. Forward some years to WMD, no arabist consulted (just as no physicist consulted in 1945) an illegal war with ethnic cleansing on a vast scale. - Ian Parker >> On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 56 lines] > The authour of this posting is a self confessed anti semite and > holocaust denier. Does this affect the validity of what he is saying. I am surprised to see "Ian Parker" assert that he is "a self confessed anti semite and holocaust denier". I suggest that Ian should hate the "sin", not the "sinner". For example, even though Jews have come into conflict with all of their neighbors through history, and although Jews have institutionalized bigotry and revisionism, and although Jews have a long history of instigating conflict and war for power and riches, one should not hate Jews, but should hate the "sins" Jews engage in, and try to call the negative effects of their sins to them, so they can learn to get along with their neighbors. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >> On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 80 lines] > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm- Hide quoted text - I am not a Nazi or anti semite. You are. I always said there was something suspicious about anti relativity. There were 3 ODESSA destinations after the war. 1) Lain America. Particularly Argentina, although there were a lot of Nazis in Paraguay. 2) The USA viz area 51/Roswell antigravity and the CIA. 3) Middle East. I am going to explore that Arab Israeli wars in this posting. What are my own views. I am an Arab supporter although not an uncritical one. I feel that a right to live in the Middle East is conferred by your contribution. It should not depend on race or creed. Israel must go back to the 1967 borders and the Arabs must guarantee peace. Palestine should be shared between Arab and Jew. This was the hope of the early Jewish settlers. If you have build your own research center with your own hands you have a right to live in the ME. This was what happened at the Weizmann Institue. The reality, largely thanks to Odessa was very different. The CIA picked the arabs to win http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/jun/01/the-first-arab-israeli-war/ I think the CIA wanted the Arabs to win. There was only one problem. The Israelis were fighting for hearth and home. The Arabs by contrast were fighting for their leaders. These next two references show the liks that Gamal Nasser had with ODESSA. http://coat.ncf.ca/our_magazine/links/issue51/articles/51_08.pdf http://www.jewukr.org/observer/eo2003/page_show_en.php?id=233 Now Relativity tells us that the CIA had no "greater good". If Nazis had all been tracked down the Middle East might have been spared its current tragedy, because that is what it is. A Nazi Egyptian Intelligence service + an Israeli victory set the seal of tragedy. You Neo Nazis blame everyone except yourself, and the Jews fill the bill when all else fails. The fact that there was no "greater good" and that should have been obvious to everyone. This is the fact that has to be hidden at all costs. http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html Saddam Hussein was a great guy until he had the temerity to invade Kuwait. Apologists for the present war say he had to be removed. Bollocks, the best way to removre him was not to have had him installed in the first place. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saddam_Hussein The CIA and its neo nazis have brought misery and tragedy to everyone. Also brfore the Iran/Iraq war the CIA gave a nod and a wink to Saddam Hussdein. It was this war and its catastrophic losses that induced Saddam Hussein to invade Kuwait. There is one particular beef I have as a scientist and that is the flying saucer cult - did the Jews start that too? Alien abduction is in fact a sleep disorder. You are in a wakeful dream state. THIS NEEDS TREATMENT - Not the CIA telling you that perhaps little green men exist. - Ian Parker >> >> On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 147 lines] > TREATMENT - Not the CIA telling you that perhaps little green men > exist. I think I'd best lay off Ian for a while. It appears from the incoherence of Ian's recent posts that the CIA (Or LGMs) planted a receiver in his brain, and it is messing up his thought processes. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >> >> On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 158 lines] > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm- Hide quoted text - I want to know about Roswell. The "blue book" which really dealt only with aliens tells only half the story. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Blue_Book This is absolutely keystone cops stuff. Not even the USAF was told about Roswell. I am also commenting on your obvious antisemitism. I am also trying to figure out how you abtained the position you claim. I am telling you that I think there must have been influence of some type between the scene. http://preposterousuniverse.com/grnotes/grtinypdf.pdf Gives a fairly good introduction. In a weak field we can reduce to R(4,4) = Delta^2(V)/c^2. All other terms are small. This is in fact Newtonian Physics. As fields get stronger, of course, the other terms start to have an effect. The other thing I have noticed about your postings, apart from them being nonsensical in physical terms, is the antisemitism. The basic fact remains. If Relativity is true ODESSA sold a pup. The question I will ask and ask repeatedly is "Why were no experts on Relativity consulted at the time?" "Why were decisions taken in a cabal of igniorami?". I see a parallel with Arabic and Iraq. Pencho Valev (and yourself) have talked about the money "wasted" on the teacing of GTR. The biggest waste of public money is, of course, Iraq. I will say now, if anyone goes not wish to learn about Relativity, perhaps they could do a course in Arabic instead. If you look at it the parallels are striking. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/cia-is-undermining-british-w ar-effort-say-military-chiefs-427848.html I am in fact British. I personally feel that our "special relationship" has brought nothing but grief. Our efforts are undermined by a secret cabal. I think Britain would do a lot better to have closer European links, end the special relationship and like other European countries withdraw completely from Iraq and have reconstruction only in Afghanistan. - Ian Parker > On Jul 13, 2:05 am, Tom Potter <tdp1...@gmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Don't run and hide Gisse. Why ask the question when you will ignore the answer? > You claim General Relativity > is a useful and viable tool, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > that Newton made hundreds of years ago > using what you assert is an inferior model. I never said it was inferior - just wrong. Newton is an excellent heuristic that is valid for most purposes - just like the rest of classical mechanics. Besides you aren't being clear enough about what you are asking. > What puzzles me is why > all of the General Relativity Gurus > are on the taxpayer dole, Because if it were up to Tom Potter, the government would never fund basic research. > and none make a living in the free market > using their powerful, esoteric knowledge. Here comes the typical crackpotter rant about how much he hates basic research. GPS and accurate [parts per trillion] time keeping are two direct advances general relativity has brought. > Considering that you should use the > best tool for the job, > I'd like to see a demonstration of > what jobs General Relativity is is the best tool for, Why ask questions whose answers have been given to you countless times over the years? If you restrict yourself to technologies that are direct functions of general relativity instead of the tremendous astrophysical benefits, you have the global positioning system and the ability to keep clocks accurate to parts per trillion levels by accounting from gravitational and kinematic effects. But that's not good enough for you, now is it? > other than computing things > beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space, > like the beginning and end of the universe, > time travel, warping through space, worm holes, etc. Thanks for deliberately playing up sci-fi crap that no scientist takes seriously in an attempt to discredit a theory you hate on personal grounds. None of the things you babble about are possible without unphysical initial conditions. > If the taxpayers is going to spend their hard earned dollars > training high school grads like you, it seems to me > that they should expect you to be taught something that > can be uses to improve the lot of mankind, > like DNA, etc. There's that requisite crack about me being a high school graduate. Did you not graduate high school, or something? Define "improve the lot of mankind". It took nearly 50 years before DNA became useful. You only defend it in hindsight because you find it useful _AFTER_ the scientists that "are on the public dole" did the basic research you would never willingly fund. > Back in the 1970's, > the taxpayers spent a lot of money > paying to teach inner city boys how to play basketball. > > I wonder if teaching boys GTR is a similar scheme to keep boys > off the streets, or if it is a useful tool for anything. Spot the lie. It starts and ends with "I wonder". You know how GR is useful, it has been explained to you nearly every time you post your inane little rant. You just don't care because _you_ don't think the technologies and science it makes possible are useful. > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm >"Eric Gisse" <jowr.pi@gmail.com> wrote in message news:42cdd046-446e-453a-a0bd-0b161a033070@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com... >> [quoted text clipped - 94 lines] >> -- >> Tom Potter As can be seen, Eric Gisse tries to create a false strawman, and make me the issue, rather than the utility of General Relativity, with the bare face lie that I oppose government funded basic research. Considering the enormous amounts of time, money, and minds spent trying to rationalize General Relativity, and educating (Brainwashing) young people, and brainwashing the masses that it is a powerful model of reality, all I ask is for ONE General Relativity Guru, or ONE General Relativity supporter (Cult Member) to demonstrate the utility of General Relativity by working out just a tiny fraction of the real world applications that Newton worked out hundreds of years ago. There is a vast difference between wisely using the taxpayers money to educate young, impressionable people, and to do "basic research" and using the taxpayers hard-earned money to promote what seems to be a non-viable, auguring model of reality promoted more for its' glorification of a particular race/religion, than for its' utility. A prime example of this is that Einstein was Time Magazine's "Man of the Century although the DNA model is used every day to fight diseases, improve food production, fight crime, reconstruct history, etc. whereas GTR is an obvious dead end, non-viable Tower of Babel, that leaves no room for sentient man, and it wastes time, money and minds on pursuits beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space, like the birth and death of the universe, time travel, warping through space, worm holes, etc. As can be seen, the General Relativity Cult parrot the false mantra that GTR was and is essential to the GPS System, when this has been shown time and again that this is a false mantra. Hopefully Gisse will work out ONE of the tides that Newton computed centuries ago to demonstrate that he understand General Relativity, and that it is a useful, cost-effective, viable tool to do the useful things for mankind. I suggest that the government should find a better way to keep Nerds off the streets, and that Nerds should be encouraged to play basketball so they will be stronger and more healthy. Friends, we've got trouble. We've got trouble right here in Anchorage. We've got to find a way to keep the Nerds off the streets, and to get them to exercise and learn useful skills. Bodies and minds are terrible things to waste. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > whereas GTR is an obvious dead end, non-viable Tower of Babel, > that leaves no room for sentient man, > and it wastes time, money and minds > on pursuits beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space, > like the birth and death of the universe, time travel, > warping through space, worm holes, etc. Potter, you certainly have misconceptions... Newton's gravitational theory didn't explain what gravitation is but does provide reasonable accuracy for calculations. GTR provides a more complete understanding of gravitation and is more accurate than Newton... orbital precession, gravitational lensing, etc. and yes, GTR predicts accurately the corrections necessary for Global Navigation Satellite Systems (GNSS). GTR is an essential tool in investigations of compact astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on! > >"Eric Gisse" <jowr...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:42cdd046-446e-453a-a0bd-0b161a033070@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com... > [quoted text clipped - 99 lines] > and make me the issue, > rather than the utility of General Relativity, That isn't a strawman, moron. That's an ad-hom at best. > with the bare face lie > that I oppose government funded basic research. Because you do. > Considering the enormous amounts of time, money, and minds > spent trying to rationalize General Relativity, > and educating (Brainwashing) young people, > and brainwashing the masses that it is > a powerful model of reality, See? > all I ask is for ONE General Relativity Guru, > or ONE General Relativity supporter (Cult Member) > to demonstrate the utility of General Relativity > by working out just a tiny fraction of the real world > applications that Newton worked out hundreds of years ago. Why should anyone do anything for you? We've been down this road before - remember your "13 hacks of general relativity" that you couldn't shut the f.ck about? Remember your denials that GR was used in the global positioning system? Whenever your idiotic arguments are bitchslapped so hard that even you can't ignore it, you simply shift the goalpost back a little bit further and make people jump through your asinine little hoops again. Frankly, who the f.ck cares what you think? I don't - responding to you serves as nothing more than entertainment. If you want to know about GR reducing to Newton, open a f.cking textbook. I'm not gonna teach you jack. > There is a vast difference between wisely using the > taxpayers money to educate young, impressionable people, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > promoted more for its' glorification of > a particular race/religion, than for its' utility. There's the antisemitism again. Can't let it go, can you crackpotter? > A prime example of this is that Einstein was Time Magazine's > "Man of the Century although the DNA model is used every day to > fight diseases, improve food production, fight crime, > reconstruct history, etc. ...and how long did it take for DNA to be useful in these industries? Pretty f.cking close to 50 years after DNA was discovered, wasn't it? Einstein's contributions to science are legendary. You just can't accept them due to your personal issues with the man. > whereas GTR is an obvious dead end, non-viable Tower of Babel, > that leaves no room for sentient man, > and it wastes time, money and minds > on pursuits beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space, > like the birth and death of the universe, time travel, > warping through space, worm holes, etc. There's the intellectual dishonesty [lying] again. > As can be seen, the General Relativity Cult > parrot the false mantra that GTR > was and is essential to the GPS System, > when this has been shown time and again that > this is a false mantra. There's the blatant lying again. Typical salesman bullshit. You know what you are saying isn't true, but you are hoping to sell your bullshit through sheer persistence since it has no merit. It isn't going to work, a.shole. We all know you are lying every time you bring up that wormhole bullshit. We all know you are lying when you say GR isn't relevant to GPS. We all know you are lying every time you open your goddamn mouth and speak. > Hopefully Gisse will work out ONE > of the tides that Newton computed centuries ago > to demonstrate that he understand General Relativity, > and that it is a useful, cost-effective, viable tool > to do the useful things for mankind. GR produces the same equations of motion and thus the same predictions at the Newtonian limit. Study the theory you attempt to poorly criticize, before opening your ignorant ex-pat mouth. > I suggest that the government should > find a better way to keep Nerds off the streets, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > We've got to find a way to keep the Nerds off the streets, > and to get them to exercise and learn useful skills. Typical MBA thinking. Thankfully you aren't in a position to influence anything, otherwise you wouldn't be whining on USENET. > Bodies and minds are terrible things to waste. Which is why your damage does not extend past you and whatever you did to your kids. > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm Next time post the rant to your blog. If nobody reads it, that tells you something. >> >"Eric Gisse" <jowr...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:42cdd046-446e-453a-a0bd-0b161a033070@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com... >> [quoted text clipped - 209 lines] >Which is why your damage does not extend past you and whatever you did >to your kids. I suggest that Gisse's reply to my post asking him to prove that the General Relativity is a viable, cost-effective, viable model by simply working out ONE of the many tides computed by Newton using his inferior model, centuries ago, should be used as a text book example of equivocation. -------------------------------------------------------- One would think that if General Relativity was such a powerful, useful model, that at least ONE of the people who hype it and pretend to be privy to power, esoteric knowledge, that they expect the taxpayers to support with education and billion dollar experiments, would simply demonstrate ONE example of the power of their esoteric knowledge, rather than waste enormous amounts of time and net resources equivocating. Let us hope that our government representatives will do a lot of RESEARCH on what models yield the greatest benefits to mankind, and put the taxpayers hard-earned money into RESEARCH using models that provide cost-effective results and benefits. With the diminishing oil supply, it appears that the free lunch is over, and that the taxpayers can no longer afford the luxury of paying kids to play basketball, and take mental masturbation courses that condition them to think they have access to powerful, esoteric knowledge. And of course on billion dollar programs RESEARCHING things beyond man's capacity to EVER experience in time and space, like the beginning and end of the universe, black holes, time travel, warping through space, etc. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm [snip repeated blather] > And of course on billion dollar programs > RESEARCHING things beyond man's capacity to EVER > experience in time and space, > like the beginning and end of the universe, black holes, > time travel, warping through space, etc. Name one project that has spent billions of dollars on any one of these. > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm On Jul 16, 9:49 pm, "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: [snip repeated blather] > And of course on billion dollar programs > RESEARCHING things beyond man's capacity to EVER > experience in time and space, > like the beginning and end of the universe, black holes, > time travel, warping through space, etc. -Name one project that has spent billions of dollars on any one of -these. You first Gisse. As I have asked many times, prove that you actually understand General Relativity, and that it is an efficient, viable model, by simply computing just ONE of the many tides that Newton calculated by hand centuries ago, using his old model. Can I put you on my list of phonies that pretend to have access to powerful knowledge? SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > On Jul 16, 9:49 pm, "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > You first Gisse. Blustering Potter cant think of any projects. Awe too bad Potter. Go back to standing under the horses a.s. >> On Jul 16, 9:49 pm, "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Blustering Potter cant think of any projects. Awe too bad Potter. > Go back to standing under the horses a.s. I'm surprised that Gisse and Wormley are ignorant of the Gravity Probe B project. Excerpts from a couple of posts I made about Gravity Probe B are listed below. As I predicted on April 11, 2007 the results to be annouinced on April 15 would be "Yes Virginia, frame dragging MIGHT occur." As can be seen, the General Relativity Welfare Mothers announced that they would "announce the final results of the experiment in December 2007". What were the "final results"? Have they proven or disproven GTR, or will they try to con the taxpayers out of a few billion more dollars for "Gravity Probe C"? Quote ====================== Newsgroups: sci.physics Subject: Gravity Probe B results Date: 15 Apr 2007 05:36:14 -0700 As I posted on 11 April 2007 Wednesday 5:06 PM, ======================================= "as can be seen by the recent news, over one billion of the tax payers dollars have been spent on just one of the many projects to rationalize General Relativity ( Gravity Probe-B ). Papers on the General Relativity experiment will be forthcoming in a few days, and maybe, just maybe, the scientists on the taxpayer dole, who promoted this project will make the astounding announcement that "Yes Virginia, frame dragging MIGHT occur." =============================================== Here is the report on the Gravity Probe B frame dragging experiment which was released today 4/15/2007. http://einstein.stanford.edu/ "The other effect, called frame-dragging, is the amount by which the rotating Earth drags local space-time around with it. According to Einstein's theory, over the course of a year, the geodetic warping of Earth's local space-time causes the spin axes of each gyroscope to shift from its initial alignment by a minuscule angle of 6.606 arc- seconds (0.0018 degrees) in the plane of the spacecraft's orbit. Likewise, the twisting of Earth's local space-time causes the spin axis to shift by an even smaller angle of 0.039 arc-seconds (0.000011 degrees) - about the width of a human hair viewed from a quarter mile away - in the plane of the Earth's equator. GP-B Scientists expect to announce the final results of the experiment in December 2007, following eight months of further data analysis and refinement. <Data has been on file for two years, and although over one billion dollars has been spent on this particular rationalization of General Relativity, they need at least eight more months to <cook the books?> ============== End quote As can be seen at the web site below, NASA took my advice and Gravity Probe B came last in the NASA review so the panel recommended cutting funding of the project. Since Bush and the NeoCons destroyed America's economy and America's standing in the world community, American taxpayers can no longer afford the luxury of funding billion dollar programs to glorify models hyped by particular races and religions for their glorification. http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/34284 SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >> On Jul 16, 9:49 pm, "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 95 lines] > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm- Hide quoted text - http://einstein.stanford.edu/content/sci_papers/papers/VanPattenR_1986_10.pdf General Scientific papers http://einstein.stanford.edu/content/sci_papers/ There is quite a lot to get one head round in terms of space technology as well. No doubt you and your ilk will want to see continuously from GEO at 10cm resolution. Here is how to make a fragmented telescope. I think you should also remember that the "dole" as you put it also gives us technology. - Ian Parker >"Ian Parker" <ianparker2@gmail.com> wrote in message news:17c10163-32a7-42ca-9cf6-2269d2588c7e@a1g2000hsb.googlegroups.com... >> >> On Jul 16, 9:49 pm, "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 106 lines] >I think you should also remember that the "dole" as you put it also >gives us technology. Thanks to my pal Ian Parker for calling my attention to how the hundreds of millions of the taxpayers, hard-earned dollars were spent on the Gravity B Probe experiment. Can you imagine the benefits to mankind if that money had been spent on the DNA model, rather than on hyping and rationalizing a non-viable model promote by people on the public dole for race/religion edification? Here is where billions of your tax dollars go folks. No doubt some positive results came from the millions spent, just as some positive results would result from throwing billions of dollars out of an airplane over Cleveland. ================================= Gravity Probe B Scientific Papers * Ultralow Density Plume Measurements Using a Helium Mass Spectrometer Y. Jafry, J. Vanden Beukel, J. Vac. Sci, Technol. A, Vol. 10, No. 4, July/August, 1992. * Temperature Control of a Liquid Helium Propulsion System P. Wiktor, Journal of Propulsion and Power, Vol. 9, Number 4, pp. 536-544 July-August 1993. * Evaporation of Superfluid Helium in a Capillary C. R. Lages, R. H. Torii and D. B. DeBra, Cryogenics , Vol. 35, No. 1, 1995. * Operational Cryogenic Experience with the Gravity Probe B Payload M. A. Taber, D. O. Murray, J. R. Maddocks, K. M. Burns, To be published in Advances in Cryogenic Engineering , Vol. 47, 2002 * Performance of the Relativity Mission Superfluid Helium Flight Dewar R. T. Parmley, G. A. Bell, D. J. Frank, D. O. Murray, and R. A. Whelan, Adv. Space Res. Vol. 32, No. 7, pp. 1407-1416, 2003. COSPAR 2003. Data Analysis * Ultra High Resolution Science Data Extraction for the Gravity Probe B Gyro and Telescope Richard Van Patten, Ray DiEsposti, John V. Breakwell, SPIE Proceedings Vol. 619, 23-24, January 1986. * The Graviy Probe B 'Niobium Bird' Experiment Verifying the Data Reduction Scheme for Estimating the Relativistic Precession of Earth-Orbiting Gyroscopes H. Uematsu, B. W. Parkinson, J. M. Lockhart, B. Muhlfelder,Spaceflight Mechanics 1993, Vol. 82, Advances in the Astronautical Sciences. * The Stanford Relativity Mission, Niobium Bird. Verification of the Science Mission by Experimental Application of a New Nonlinear Estimation Algorithm G. T. Haupt, G.Gutt, J. M. Lockhart, N. J. Kasdin, G. M. Keiser, B. W. Parkinson, 18th Annual AAS Guidance and Control Conference, Keystone, Colorado, February 1-5, 1995. * An Optimal Recursive Iterative Algorithm for Discrete Nonlinear Least-Squares Estimation G. Haupt, N. Kasdin, G. Keiser, and B. Parkinson, AIAA Guidance, Navigation, andControl Conference, August 7-10, 1995 AIAA-95-3218. * Data Reduction, Error and Analysis and Identification of Systemic Errors in the Gravity Probe B Experiment M. I. Heifetz. C.W. F. Everitt, G. M. Keiser, A. S. Silbergleit, Proceedings of the Eighth Marcel Grossman Meeting on General Relativity. Ed: Tsvi Piran, World Scientific, Singapore, Part A, pp 259-268, 1999. * Data Analysis in the Gravity Probe B Relativity Experiment M. I. Heifetz, G. M. Keiser, Proceedings of the Second International Conference on Information Fusion, Volume II, FUSION-99. < References to hundreds of Gravity Probe B papers deleted. For the people who prefer the glorification of races, religions, and personalities over learning about things like DNA that make life better for mankind, visit the URL below. http://einstein.stanford.edu/content/sci_papers Billions of the taxpayer's dollars are terrible things to waste. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > Billions of the taxpayer's dollars are terrible things to waste. Care to detail these "billions" of dollars... or were you referring wars and "projects" in the middle east. Newton's gravitational theory didn't explain what gravitation is but does provide reasonable accuracy for calculations. GTR provides a more complete understanding of gravitation and is more accurate than Newton... orbital precession, gravitational lensing, etc. and yes, GTR predicts accurately the corrections necessary for Global Navigation Satellite Systems (GNSS). You've got to admit, Potter, that GPS have proved to be quite the utility for the world... generating tens of billions of dollars of economic and utilitarian benefit to the peoples of this world. Both the quantum mechanics and general relativity have made that possible. :-) GTR is an essential tool in investigations of compact astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on! >> Billions of the taxpayer's dollars are terrible things to waste. > > Care to detail these "billions" of dollars... or were you referring > wars and "projects" in the middle east. Try the URLs below for starters: http://www.misunderstooduniverse.com/Gravity_Probe_B_Cosmic_Money_Pit.htm http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9682351 "The team had planned to release its results around now. But there have been problems: The results so far are 1,000 times less precise than what the team had expected. Much of the trouble came from the gyroscopes. The spheres inside carried small patches of electric charge, which subtly disturbed their motion. Physicist Francis Everitt at Stanford University is the project's leader. He says the team will be able to subtract the disturbance and <hack> the data. NASA recently gave the Gravity Probe B team several million more dollars to continue their work. The team hopes to have better results by the end of the year." It's past the end of the year. Where are the "better results"? I must point out that the Gravity Probe B gang used all kinds of Newtonian and Maxwellian physics in their effort to hack the project data to fit Einstein's model. SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >> Billions of the taxpayer's dollars are terrible things to waste. > [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > in their effort to hack the project data > to fit Einstein's model. It is a good thing that they found these things out. Well worth the money for the technological know how. I have noticed too that you seem to be posting the same anti semitic twaddle in many different places. Would you be any chance be "Puppet Sock" or anyone else? I have set up a second account myself just to show how easy it is. I think I will keep it. It might be needed if and when I investigate parsing in inflected languages (Arabic) and compression of a parse generated sequence. BTW - I think it is quite appalling that we still seem to live in the age of Galileo. >> >> Billions of the taxpayer's dollars are terrible things to waste. >> [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] >BTW - I think it is quite appalling that we still seem to live in the >age of Galileo. I am surprised to see that "Talebun" thinks that it is worthwhile to spend billions of the taxpayers dollars on projects motivated more by the edification of a specific race/religion, than by the returns to the taxpayers. As I indicated in my post, no doubt, if you tossed a billion dollars out of an airplane over Cleveland, some good would result from it, but is this a good project to use the taxpayers money for? Regarding "Talebun" question: "Would you be any chance be "Puppet Sock" or anyone else?", As can be seen from the many pictures of me on my web sites, and from my many years of posting on the net, I am "someone else". But considering the question, "Puppet Sock" must make some very interesting posts, so I will Google and read some of his posts. Regarding "Talebun" comment: "you seem to be posting the same anti Semitic twaddle in many different places." I am of the school, "hate the sin, love the sinner", and I place a great value on truth and justice. It appears that when I point out the historical fact that Jews have come into conflict with all of their neighbors throughout history, and that they have a long history of instigating conflict and war for power and riches, that "Talebun" confuses this with being "anti-Semitic". Of course, even if I were anti-Semitic, I would be in the vast majority, as most folks throughout history have been anti-Semitic according to what many Jews say, and of course most of the folks on the planet today are anti-Semitic. If "Talebun" doesn't believe me, he should read what many Jews have to say in the media and on the net, about people being anti-Semetic. I never hear Germans, Englishmen, Asians, Mexicans, Mormons, Hindus, etc, saying "You hate me because I am a "XXXXX", but as many Jews are loudly proclaiming that folks are anti-semetic, so they must be right. The question is, why have most folks been, and why are most folks now, anti-Semitic? SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > One would think that if General Relativity > was such a powerful, useful model... Potter, you certainly have misconceptions... Newton's gravitational theory didn't explain what gravitation is but does provide reasonable accuracy for calculations. GTR provides a more complete understanding of gravitation and is more accurate than Newton... orbital precession, gravitational lensing, etc. and yes, GTR predicts accurately the corrections necessary for Global Navigation Satellite Systems (GNSS). GTR is an essential tool in investigations of compact astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on! If all you can think about is how over-eating is bad for you, so that you're constantly dwelling on it, to the exclusion of all else, you'll never stop being a foodaholic. Same goes for Gisse dwelling on stuff he doesn't like ( e.g. non-textbook physics ) or Potter dwelling on what he doesn't like ( e.g. General Relativity ). Tom's basketball and Eric's textbooks are both insane wastes of time, I say; it's more productive to post to UseNet, surf Google, etc. . As I see it, Tom would have us earning money we don't need, just to burn up the only planet he have, like a log in the fire. Anything short of hibernation will shorten your life .. and even that could kill you toot sweet. Same goes for humanity as a whole. “ U.S.A. Inc. ” is like a party .. call it “ DisneyLand ” if you will. Pay the “ entrance fees ” ( a.k.a. “ rent ” or “ taxes ” ) and obey the “ regulations ” .. or be “ evicted ” ( i.e. kicked out ). For oft' random reasons, the homeless are “ The Evicted ”. It's the right of every “ land Lord ” ( e.g. yourself, the government, etc. ) to “ evict ” on a whim. Going up a level, every landLord is a “ tenant ”. Nothing is acausl, randomness is always ignorance, nothing more. The cosmos “ just is ” .. 4-D static, 4-D motionless, 4-D unchanging. “ The Mind of God ” ( the “ HyperMind ”, if you will ) is choiceless; but “ The Mind of Man ” ( 3-D ) must pay “ rent ” or get “ evicted ”. Gravitational fields can't be anything other than 4-D space, no matter how imponderable .. otherwise you'd have to ask: “ What's fueling it ? ” and “ How efficient is it ? ”. Likely, intrinsic mass and electromagnetic fields are also 4-D fields, but that's so much more imponderable that it almost doesn't matter. Further, mass is a form of energy. Given two identical lasers, one beaming from a station on Earth to a geosynchronous satellite, the other from the satellite back to the station .. While the speed of the beam received by the satellite exactly matches the one received at the station, the Earth-bound beam has more inertia .. more energy .. more Mass . > If all you can think about is how over-eating is bad for you, > so that you're constantly dwelling on it, to the exclusion of all else, > you'll never stop being a foodaholic. > > Same goes for Gisse dwelling on stuff he doesn't like > ( e.g. non-textbook physics ) Since when? [snip] On occasion, I read what you post to Sci.Physics, including your 33 most recent posts. I see you dwelling on what you don't like ( to wit: non-textbook physics ) to the exclusion of what you do like: textbook physics. Everyone But You knows that. > On occasion, I read what you post to Sci.Physics, > including your 33 most recent posts. > > I see you dwelling on what you don't like > ( to wit: non-textbook physics ) to the exclusion of what you do like: > textbook physics. Everyone But You knows that. For what value of "everyone" ? The vast, vast majority of what interests me is not printed in any textbooks. What is printed in textbooks is either only the basics or horribly outdated. > > On occasion, I read what you post to Sci.Physics, > > including your 33 most recent posts. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > textbooks. What is printed in textbooks is either only the basics or > horribly outdated. It takes time for current concepts to be taught as bob standard. Relativity can be classed, now at any rate, as bog standard. The fact that the thread was renamed is to me indicative of something. Next time I change it it we be changed to " The Black Sun and Aldebaran [khayyid?]" That to me can be the only reason for this sniping. You see when people accept a theory that is experimentally confirmed there is no neeed to impute motives, they are following scientific method. The criticism, both in type and volume, of Relativity suggests strong ulterior motives. - Ian Parker >> On Jul 18, 8:54 am, Jeff$B"%(BRelf <Jeff_R...@0.Invalid> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > criticism, both in type and volume, of Relativity suggests strong > ulterior motives. Ian Parker makes a good point when he points out that unscrupulous people con the masses into accepting models in order to promote their selfish agendas. For example, Aztec priests conned the public into accepting their model that if they ripped out the hearts of people, that the sun would come up in the morning. Jews conned the public into accepting much of their religious model. Freud conned the masses into accepting his doped up, sexed up perception of how the mind works. Marx and Engel conned some of the masses into accepting class warfare. The America NeoCons conned Bush and some Americans into accepting religious warfare. The best measure of a model is its' utility in a few and open market, not how it pits one class against another, one religion against another, one race against another. For example, rational, intelligent folks who want to learn how to judge the value of models should compare the General Relativity model with the DNA model. Note that although General Relativity has been enormously hyped for one hundred years, and Einstein was made Time Magazine's "Man of the Century" and the masses were conned into thinking that he was the most intelligent man who ever lived, that Einstein's model is a Tower of Babel that wastes time, money and minds on such pursuits as time travel, warping through space, the beginning and end of the universe, worm holes, etc. whereas the DNA model is used every day to improve health, create better crops, create better live stock, fight crime, reconstruct history, etc. Thanks Ian for pointing out that the enormous hype of "Relativity suggests strong ulterior motives." I suggest that this "ulterior motive" is to portray Jews as intelligent, virtuous victims rather than a criminal gang that has come into conflict with all of their neighbors throughout history. Your pal, SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > The best measure of a model is its' utility > in a few and open market... Na, You're wrong Potter, the measure of a scientific model is in the data agreeing with the models predictions. For example, there predictions of Special and general relativity have never been contradicted, but confirmed, by observations. Newton's gravitational theory didn't explain what gravitation is but does provide reasonable accuracy for calculations. GTR provides a more complete understanding of gravitation and is more accurate than Newton... orbital precession, gravitational lensing, etc. and yes, GTR predicts accurately the corrections necessary for Global Navigation Satellite Systems (GNSS). You've got to admit, Potter, that GPS have proved to be quite the utility for the world... generating tens of billions of dollars of economic and utilitarian benefit to the peoples of this world. Both the quantum mechanics and general relativity have made that possible. :-) GTR is an essential tool in investigations of compact astronomical objects... binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on! >> The best measure of a model is its' utility >> in a few and open market... [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. > And so on! Sammy makes a good point! "GTR is an essential tool" if you want to model things beyond man's capacity to ever experience in time and space such as "binary pulsars, supernovae, quasars, supermassive black holes, galactic evolution and galactic cluster evolution... Dark Matter distribution and cosmology. And so on!" ( Time travel, warping through space, worm holes, the beginning and end of the universe, the mind of God, etc.) Of course, Sammy makes a bad point when he parrots the lie that General relativity was and is essential to the GPS System. Shame on you Sammy!!! SignatureTom Potter http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.html http://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.com http://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/ http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.com http://groups.msn.com/PotterPhotos http://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm > >> The best measure of a model is its' utility > >> in a few and open market... [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > that General relativity was and is > essential to the GPS System. Why do you continue to lie, crackpotter? http://www.leapsecond.com/history/Ashby-Relativity.htm\ http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/gps/geninfo/IS-GPS-200D.pdf Its' right there in the spec. Again - why do you continue to lie? > Shame on you Sammy!!! > > -- > Tom Potter > > http://www.geocities.com/tdp1001/index.htmlhttp://notsocrazyideas.blogspot.comht tp://www.flickr.com/photos/tom-potter/http://tdp1001.wiki.zoho.comhttp://groups. msn.com/PotterPhotoshttp://www.androcles01.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dingleberry.htm "Tom Potter" <t...@hotsheet.com> wrote: > "Sam Wormley" <sworml...@mchsi.com> wrote: > > Tom Potter wrote: Tom Potter wrote: The best measure of a model is its' |
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